Boiling tips

ranger 3 · February 12, 2009, 09:02:00 AM

How long does the wood have to dry after boiling tips before you can continue working on the stave? I am going to recurve the tips...Howard

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 09:14:00 AM

If your wood is already dry I would suggest not boiling the tips unless you can totally seal them from the moisture. As they dry they are likely to check.
Dry wood, dry heat...wet wood, wet heat!
I use a heat gun and oil. After bending I allow them to cool overnight before stressing them. Pat

Shaun · February 12, 2009, 09:41:00 AM

Brad Merkel uses boiling for extreme recurves, but I always liked dry heat on dry wood like Pat said. If you recurve the tips far they will break fibers on the outside of the curve. I recurve the tip while it is still thick - 5/8" or so - and rasp off the belly side where it separates. Go slow and "feel" the give in the wood as you heat it.

John Scifres · February 12, 2009, 10:00:00 AM

For a big static bend, I like to boil. It's safer especially if you haven't done much heatgunning. I've never had any check on me. I really don't think they take up too much water anyway. Give it maybe a week to dry after boiling. It helps to shellac it and also, boil just the tips, not the working section.

ranger 3 · February 12, 2009, 10:23:00 AM

Here is a pic. of my jig, is a 2X 4 and the bend is about 7" so dry or boil

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 12:39:00 PM

Here are 3 pics of one form I use with dry heat(and oil). Note the thickness of the tips. When I first bend the tips I use the metal strap to support the belly side to help prevent splinters from lifting. Like Shaun said, I keep the tips thick then reduce them after bending. If I do get splinters I fill with super glue before reducing just in case I don't get them all rasped out. The other 2 pics show making alignment bends so I didn't use the metal strap.

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 12:44:00 PM

The tips on this bow were also bent with dry heat (and oil) but on a different, more radical form.

Art B · February 12, 2009, 01:22:00 PM

What type of wood are you using Howard? Like John, I've never had any wood check from boiling or steaming. I usually wait a couple days after boiling before working the wood again. If at any time you lose some curve, just put it back in your form and set with dry heat (heat treat) this time. Here, your wood must be absolutely dry.

ART B

ranger 3 · February 12, 2009, 01:31:00 PM

It is Osage Art, nice bow and snaky arrows Pat...Howard

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 01:42:00 PM

Osage bends easy with heat!!!

Art B · February 12, 2009, 02:29:00 PM

If'n I ever get the nerve up Pat, I'm going to shoot your "Ole Snakey" arrow!!! Quick as my draw weight is declining it shouldn't be much longer, hehe!

Yep, osage bends great using heat!

ART B

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 03:01:00 PM

Art, that arrow flew OK for about 10 yards but went haywire after that. I think the fletching is the culprit.
Howard, I gave the bottom arrow to Art and the second from the top with red fletching to Bernie Dunn. The arrow I gave to Bernie shoots very well. Gets lots of looks at the practice line too.
I traded that bow to a blacksmith friend for one of his hand forged knives. Pat

tim roberts · February 12, 2009, 03:19:00 PM

Could some please explain where and how the oil is used?
Thanks,

Pat B · February 12, 2009, 03:56:00 PM

I use olive oil because that's what we have around. Any cooking oil will work. I just dip my finger in the oil and rub it liberally on the wood where I am going to heat.

KILLER B · February 12, 2009, 04:34:00 PM

The oil is used to keep from burning the wood. I think it also helps with heat transfer (not letting it cool as fast).

Roy Steele · February 12, 2009, 09:19:00 PM

I don't heat or boil anymore.But to recurve the tips I've only done them on a molded when green.but what PAT said is 100% true.Dry wood dry heat,wet wood wet heat.I did both a good deal at one time but never had a checking problem.

tim roberts · February 12, 2009, 10:51:00 PM

Thanks for the info guys!
Roy sent you a PM.

John Scifres · February 13, 2009, 08:57:00 AM

That is a pretty mild recurve. I would use dry heat on that one myself. I think I sent you this pics but the form on left is what I would boil. The one on right, I would heatgun.

I have never used oil with a heatgun. Keep the gun moving and at least 4" away and you shouldn't scorch. Also, patience is the ultimate bowyer's tool. It would take me at least 10 and likely 15 minutes to bend each side of that recurve. Get into a zen mode, feel the warming, then the heating then the plasticity of the wood and then gently tighten your clamps. It takes a long time to warm an osage stave through to make all the wood plastic. It's when we heat unevenly that we start screwing up.

John Scifres · February 13, 2009, 09:04:00 AM

This was just an experiment but it shows what happens with dry heat applied too fast to a radical curve. I'm not saying it can't be done because I actually could have salvaged even this botch job but boiling is safer and ultimately easier for me.

See how the wood actually buckled on the sides? The belly was warmer than the back. It was also scorched, kind of intentionally. This was using the form in the pic above.

ranger 3 · February 13, 2009, 02:03:00 PM

Should I keep the limbs 5/8 or floor tiller it?

Howard