Rod says his release is dynamic as well....I was just stating what Rod has said to me AND posted here before.

He posted here that he was shooting dymanic just like me....only MUCH slower.

Again, he explains it on his 'Tip' portion of his site.

I don't know anything about Rick Welch's shot so I can't comment on that. But, I loved his hog hunting videos from a few years ago.  

Dynamic.

A dead release is like stopping the baseball bat as soon as you touch the baseball, or racket, or club, etc.  Your body has to set into all kinds of shot impacting processes to stop the archery swing.

I thought I knew where I was, but now - looking at Rod Jenkins - I ain't so sure.  He's stopped dead for a good four seconds and then pulls his hand away from the string.  I pause for a half-breath-let-out or a second or two and then pull my bow elbow straight back while relaxing by hand (which goes back just a little bit as my forearm doesn't shrink any??)  Maybe I'm more dynamic than I thought.  When bunny hunting I'm definately dynamic as I release as a part of the draw and swing.  But I still never get the tip of my thumb past my ear.

I know if I think about it too much I scatter arrows.    

QuoteOriginally posted by Stumpkiller:
looking at Rod Jenkins - I ain't so sure.  He's stopped dead for a good four seconds and then pulls his hand away from the string.  

If you ask Rod.....he'll tell you he doesn't stop pulling even though it might look like it.

You can read about it on his 'tip' page once you scroll down past the hero pics.

QuoteOriginally posted by Stumpkiller:
I thought I knew where I was, but now - looking at Rod Jenkins - I ain't so sure.  He's stopped dead for a good four seconds

Actually, I'm pulling my guts out for a good four seconds  

Pulling (back tension) is a three phases afair...(1)excessing pulling to anchor (2) balanced pulling at anchor (3) increased pulling to conclusion. I think maybe where some may be getting confused is.... when the transfer to  back tension occurs( 2&3), there very little rearward string movement...the rotation of the scapula caused by the Rhomboids move the draw side elbow around.

Rod, would you agree with this:  anybody, whether it's you or Rick Welch, is going to have to pull the same, assuming the same bow weight, to keep the arrow from creeping forward while they hold it at full draw.  The difference between a dead release and a dynamic release is the amount of increased pulling to conclusion.  A dead release is when the hand stays in place and a dynamic release is when the hand recoils back toward the neck.

QuoteOriginally posted by SHOOTO8S:
... when the transfer to  back tension occurs( 2&3), there very little rearward string movement...the rotation of the scapula caused by the Rhomboids move the draw side elbow around.

Once I understood this part I didn't have to ask what back tension felt like, when you try to move your elbow around (in what Terry calls a "J") you can feel your rhomboids engage. I had to work to also get my bow side rhom to engage, because I wasn't thinking about it.

Dave..IMO the only way the release can be dead is to stop pulling at some point. That being said, some folks can time that collapse as to not ruin a shot, and obtain good results...problem is,after watching 100's of shooters in slo-mo...those shooters who can time the collapse as to be dead at release, are very,very, few and far between!
I do agree its gonna taking the same amount of pulling in regards to draw weight to prevent creep, no matter whether you call your release dead or dynamic

[/qb][/QUOTE]Once I understood this part I didn't have to ask what back tension felt like,  [/QB][/QUOTE]

How right you are!    


In my clinics, I always try to remember and ask the group how many here understand back tension? Typically I'll have 5-6 out of a group of 12 that raise their hand....after the second day, I'll ask...now how many understood back tension, and no one will raise their hand. Most of what everyone calls back tension is actually shoulder tension....or some achieve BT then at the time BT is most important(when the fingers stop holding the string) lose back tension.

"Once I understood this part I didn't have to ask what back tension felt like,

some achieve BT then at the time BT is most important(when the fingers stop holding the string) lose back tension."

It's a hard concept to maintain back tension for 1-2 sec while also relaxing string fingers, I had this problem but it was controlled to a degree where I could still shoot to a good level, I would transfer load after I reach anchor and maintain that balance and just relax fingers when shot felt good, it wasn't a dead release but it wasn't very dynamic either.

It took a LOT of work and help from Fita coach's to make this internal mental change but I see it paying off now as my consistency has gone up alot and have zero bad days.      

QuoteOriginally posted by SHOOTO8S:

QuoteOriginally posted by Stumpkiller:
[qb]  I think maybe where some may be getting confused is.... when the transfer to  back tension occurs( 2&3), there very little rearward string movement...the rotation of the scapula caused by the Rhomboids move the draw side elbow around. [/b]

Yeah....that 'J' shaped movement I diagrammed in the Form Clock thread.

 

This is me shooting world field champs last year, as you con see the back tension stops straight after the release, I got away with it because I repeated that action consistently and I have a rock solid bow hand.

I made the switch to Recurve in the Autumn and took the time learning a new bow to work on a more dynamic release

  World Field champs

rod jenkins sez never stop pulling the video hitting em like howard hill shows a dead release but ithink at anchor the pull continued only with control at at release my perception anyway my hand comes back on my face a bit what howard said with both hands do nothing imho

I have the same style as Ron LaClair. Hold at anchor and put forward presure on the bow handle. At release my string hand does not move. Bow moves ever so slightly forward. Works pretty good for me.

Howard had a dymamic release......

  Howard\\'s Shooting clips...

Ron LaClair also has a dynamic release at times....

  Ron\\'s shooting clips...

I use a release like longStick64, no one really has a dead release anyway, to every action there is a equal and opposite reaction.

I use a triple anchor, right of mouth, thumb knuckle behind jaw bone, and feather touching nose, I try and keep my hand from moving after release abut it always comes back a little to my right shoulder.

I think that what many people call a dead release is simply tension in the arm and shoulder which stops the rebound of the arm.. Getting them to relax the arm and shoulder muscles, making the arm a hook connected to the back will allow the around and down recoil..

imo, all releases are "dynamic", there is no such thing as a "dead release" where the string hand doesn't move and only the fingers relax off the string.  video yer "dead release" and you will *always* see the string hand move, even if you try to suppress that movement, it's still there.  this is pure, elemental physics at work.  

back in the 60's, when i shot lots of freestyle recurve fingers target archery (what's now considered "olympic archery"), the "flying release" was the goal and it was the total opposite of the "suppressed dead release" in that you were encouraged to *make* the string hand move rearward.  

i think that good archery shooting form will differ from archer to archer, in that we are all somewhat physically/biomechanically different, and the bottom line is always good alignment and consistent form.  oh yeah, it always helps to have yer mental head screwed on tight, too.  the quest continues forever, and ever, and always ....

Your holding the bow wieght , how could it not be dynamic.

I agree with Rob.

I always thought I had  a dead release. My string hand ends up near my anchor after I release.

Then I tried an experiment. I shot with a wall about one inch behind my string hand elbow. I figured that if my release is truly dead my elbow will remain an inch from the wall. Well, my elbow hit the wall pretty hard.

So here is my theory: All releases are dynamic. Most are more visible than others, but even the elbows/hands that don't look like they are going back do have some movement.

My 2 cents worth.