Trad Gang

I've struggled with my bowhunting since going from compounds to my longbow. I've killed one nice buck, the other shots I've taken has missed or almost without fault, hit high.

I hit a buck in Kansas this year - high of course, and I've got to change something, I can't/won't do it anymore. I simply MUST change something, to feel like I'm trying to better myself as a bowhunter and to NOT wound deer in the future.

That said, I'm trying to go 4-5 pounds heavier in draw weight, with maybe 100 grains more on my total arrow weight. That'll help penetration and me still be able to control my bow.

The only thing else .... I stay seated when I shoot at deer. I've always done it, I don't like risking deer seeing my movement. I'm wondering now, if thats having an affect on my shots going high ?

Does anyone else shoot sitting down ?

I practice in a treestand in my yard sitting down, not all the time, but I'm confortable with it.

I'm just trying to do everything I can, to figure out WHY I cannot seem to get my arrows to hit where I'm wanting them to. I swear I'm concentrating on a spot ..... and then my arrows sail high. Its the most frustrating thing I've ever had to go through, because I'm a pretty good shot, I practice a lot, I work with my arrows/broadheads and bows ........ and to put all that work into it and then high 6" high and lost the deer is driving me back to a compound  

I usually stand when I shoot but this year I killed a doe while sitting. I don't think your position has as much to do with it as other things. It sounds like somehow you've lost your form. When I start shooting badly, I always go back to the basics and start over.

I like to aim low on a deer especially if they are alert. If you aim at the bottom of the vitals when the deer jumps the string you sill hit the center of the vitals.

You can't change being human...Might just be the deer jumping the string...You may be looking at the outline of the deer upon release...Shooting sitting down needs to be practiced...It's human to get worked up when game comes within bow range...

So many "simple" factors add up to a miss or high hit/poor hit...I know...Been there...Alot

Don't give up the ship just yet. We all "need" to practice hunting shots...That's the fun part of Trad hunting...All The RIGHT kind of practice.

Got some questions for ya:
How far/close were the shots?
Do you use bright color feathers?
Gap Shoot or Instictive?

I'll say again. I'm no deer killing king pin but maybe a pea brain like me can help some.

>>-----> mike <-----<<

If you're shooting sitting down from a treestand, you may be torqueing the lower limb by putting too much heel pressure on the grip.  That's why the standard advice has always been to bend from the waist.... it keeps your body in the same relation to your bow, string, etc., as it normally is when you're standing on the ground practicing.

It doesn't take much lower limb torque to throw an arrow high.

Try some treestand practice both ways, sitting, and standing while bending at the waist.  That will show you quickly if that's the problem.

Standing or sittin,....you still need to bend at the waist toward the target....if you are shooting down and sitting straight up...that very well could be why you are shooting high....try leaning forward just like you do when standing.

I think Terry's right. Every deer I've shot with a bow has been from sitting in a climbing stand. You sound like your on top of the shooting-while-sitting thing, I'd guess it's something else.

Also agree with aiming low, I try to think "high heart" or similar as most my shots are pretty close & angling down. That said, it is easy to shoot high at a deer from any height or angle, and not just with a bow. Maybe it's instinctual in us humans or something...

I practice the sitting down and shooting quite alot, and with good success.  But find that if I'm cold and hold the bow near horizontal that I either torque it up or raise the arm.  If I'm comfortable and warm no problem.

hey Brad...how are you doing?   :)
I practice sitting, hunt sitting, and shoot sitting...I'm getting old and lazy.  LOL.
Bob

JUst my 2 cents , if ya cant shoot sitting down , ur prob over bowed...i shot rabbit the other day on my knees, good luck! :)

Bob - struggling, thats how I'm doing  :(

I know about the "bending at the waist" ...... and thats why I'm not going to shoot that way anymore. Eliminate one more factor that might be causing me to hit high.

I use all white fletching with bright 3M reflective tape.

One deer was about 12 steps ...... this years buck was about 21-22 steps I'd guess, absolute broadside, stopped still with a mahhhhh. I remember both arrow flights ...... both hit way high of where I wanted them to by 6-7", but exactly left/right just up/down issue

The first deer that I ever killed with traditional equipment, I did so sitting down. I haven't shot any more sitting down since then but I think siting down is a real stable platform for shooting.

I do on occasion, and I practice it often from both my tower and from my pop-up blind - just in case the occasion does arise.

i alway's shoot from a stand in a sitting postion, works for me

I always stand.

Practice both ways so it is normal for you.  Practicing while standing and hunting while you are sitting could cause problems.  

Now..the REAL  question......anybody practice while LAYING down ?     :D

I'm trying to find the "why" of my arrows always seeming to hit higher than I want them to.

I swear if I took a 70 yard shot, I'd hit 6" high  :(

I do practice from a tree stand, with hunting clothes on, sitting down - trying to mock hunting as closely as I can.

Wow..if I was only 6" high at 70 yards...I'd be pretty happy !

I know what you mean Brad.  So many things can change your arrow flight.  This makes it difficult to assess on line.  

Maybe try taking some video of you shooting in various poses and positions and watch yourself in action.  

Sometimes we change the position of our hand (heel the bow or use a higher wrist hold), or we squeeze harder one time, or we anchor ever so slightly different if we are, say, seated vs standing, or we hold our head differently in the same circumstances.  From above, or from below for that matter, the arrow travels a shorter horizontal distance to the target than it appears and naturally tends to hit higher, hence the need to aim lower from a treestand....all these things could cause you to shoot high.  

Or, maybe you just need to keep at the practice for a while more.  What really helps me is getting into the woods, or even the back yard, and just roving, one arrow only.  Start short and after you get into it, any target range you chose is fair game.  I try to just have fun and just forget about whether I hit or not.  Eventually it all comes around for me.

Stay in there.
ChuckC

When hunting, I shoot from a sitting, kneeling and also one knee positions. I hunt the ground, no more tree stands for me. (just my preference). I also practice this way, but also do plenty of standing shots. I find shooting from a sitting position to be quite easy. Leaning into the shot as mentioned by others is a must. Sitting up straight will mess you up every time.

Brad,

I do not necessarly think your problem is due to sitting v.s. standing. I shoot sitting and the advantages I see to it v.s. standing is that it is extreemly stable, and from that position I can bend at the waist more so than standing without compromising my balance.

The two main factors I have found to cause me to shoot high are:
1. Not keeping my chin tucked in for the shot. (sometimes we slightly elevate our chin to get a secondary perspective on the shot especially when we are concentrating on not missing)

2. Sometimes at the moment of truth I slow down and over evaluate my shot, trying to insure a good shot. What ends up happening is that I do not complete my draw, and therefore my hands are both just slightly higher than they would be if I were pulling tightly into my anchor. You've got to tell yourself to "Bear Down on the Shot"

Alot of it is mental, you have to be thinking not that you don't want to miss, but that you are going to hit them there and how hard you are going to hit them there.  

Hang in there.

QuoteAlot of it is mental, you have to be thinking not that you don't want to miss, but that you are going to hit them there and how hard you are going to hit them there

I'm almost afraid to shoot at a deer now for fear of wounding it ....... yes, its gotten that bad.   :(

All my basement practice is sitting (false ceiling issue!). I don't really note any difference. When I start practicing from a tree stand come summer, I'll split it between standing and sitting.

Let me prefix this by saying I'm not trying to be a smartass...

But maybe you are not an instictive traditional archer. Maybe you need to use gap shooting or a bowsite.

Brad, I did the same thing twice this year. Backstrap trauma to both deer. Sickening, I know. Hitting ABOVE the spine on both does. Both sitting. The other 4 that I shot were all standing, only 1 hitting high the rest double lungers. I had changed these variables:

1. Standing instead of sitting (duh)
2. Insuring my anchor and "tucking my chin" as mentioned above
3. I shoot GAP so I picked my spot lower than I would on the ground to offset the height like I used to do with wheels.

Result, 3 dead does, and I hate to say, shoulder high on a giant. The latter was nerves and a slight deflection. I feel certain he would have ended up as dead as the rest if I would have kept myself under control. Now, I've been where you are it, and that last one 'bout killed me. It combined with the 2 earlier jobs had me thinking of quitting. It helped to see that big deer on his feet and healthy 2 weeks later (as well as the other night), and I have vowed to make myself a better bowhunter instead of allowing it to consume me. Get back on the horse and find your confidence. It's there, and a change in equipment might make things worse instead of better. If you are comfortable with the weight, I wouldn't go up. My 2 cents, only! Good luck.

Brad...a confidence problem is tough to just overcome.  By that I mean, you cannot just say..."OK...this one is gonna be right".  I truly suggest you get that bow out with you every chance you get and stump shoot or rove, or whatever you may call that practice.  

This will do two things.  First ...lots of fun practice. Don't make it boring.  Second, lots of DIFFERENT practice, uphill, down, sitting standing, heck even laying down if you want to have fun.  Point is you are practicing and it doesn't matter if you hit or miss.  

You will start to become friends with your bow and you will get to the point where you don't think when you shoot, you don't analyse (hold here aim there, tuck this, pull that), it just all happens because you have done it all a million times before.  

Everyone is different, and some will tell you they need to go thru a series of preparatory steps.  That's fine...for them.  I find that, if I am not thinking about it, I am hitting it.  It just happens.  When I start analysing and don't just let my abilities flow...well, anything can happen.

This season is over, work on next year.  Put in the time and practice.  See that you can hit what you aim at.  It will happen.
ChuckC

QuoteThis will do two things. First ...lots of fun practice. Don't make it boring. Second, lots of DIFFERENT practice, uphill, down, sitting standing, heck even laying down if you want to have fun. Point is you are practicing and it doesn't matter if you hit or miss.

I'll add that, in my opinion, one of the best ways to do this is at tournaments.  Shoot at as many different ones as you can--that way you aren't picking the shot, or the way the target is set.  You will be in unfamiliar surroundings, and have a bit of pressure on you as well when others in your group are watching, plus you have folks there to help critique your form.

You don't have to compete, you don't even have to keep score (lots of folks don't).  It helped me a lot.

Chad

I shoot from sitting or standing.  Out of a treestand and ground.  I do practice all shots.  Sitting on the ground is my favorite because you can go undetected.  Place the bow horizontally to the ground and shoot.  I missed a shot on a turkey that way this year.  
You are putting yourself in the right position to kill deer.  You may just be over thinking it.  If you think you are going to hit high, you will!  Without fail.  Try thinking less during you shooting sequence.  JMHO.  Good luck.

QuoteBut maybe you are not an instictive traditional archer. Maybe you need to use gap shooting or a bowsite.

Possibly so ...... although in practice I do well.

I can't leave what I'm doing alone - the results are NOT what I want.


ChuckC - not many people have shot as many arrows through a bow as I have this one. OL sent it to me in 2000 and its seen thousands of arrows go through it. I do stump shoot, practice varying ranges, in a stand, throughout the spring, summer and during archery season.

My practice is good, my shooting good, I know my bow and my arrows, my practice arrows go where they want to. And then, I shoot at a live deer and I hit high ? Not left and right ...... just high.

My lost KS buck this year was perfect arrow flight, right behind the shoulder .... and high. I thought the angle I should have killed him, even high hit, but I didn't get but a few inches penetration.

I'm wanting a 55-56# recurve with another 100 grains in my arrows to help overcome that potential problem.

But there still is the problem WHY I'm hitting high ?

I stay as calm as most hunters I've seen, I'm not a rookie. Is it truly just a focus issue ? I ran the shot through my mind countless times and then when I took it ... I shot high.

:(

A single pin ....... to force me to focus might be the ticket, but I've shot instinctive for 5 years now, the switch would be very odd.

Better to re-learn how to focus, to re-find the ability to shoot and hit live animals where I want to.

 

QuoteYou are putting yourself in the right position to kill deer. You may just be over thinking it. If you think you are going to hit high, you will! Without fail. Try thinking less during you shooting sequence. JMHO. Good luck.

gosh that sounds so easy !

I passed shots this year ya'll would slap me over. I had one 10 pointer maybe 6-7 steps out and he gave me all kinds of shot selections, to my left, and none just ever was perfect. I passed a nice AR buck because he wasn't perfect broadside. Most guys would have killed both those deer. I passed a 140" 10 pointer in KS as he quartered away .... I wanted broadside, dead stop in his tracks. Ya'll would have killed that buck.

I waited and waited, and got that perfect shot ...... and hit high. I have to change something to feel like I'm addressing this, you know ? I can't say "well, maybe next time .... " when I've lost 3 deer in a row. 2 of those deer likely lived, I'm thinking more and more this buck in KS I hit lived. Initially I didn't think so, but looking back I don't think I got even 1 lung. No way he went as far as he did hit that hard.


Anyway, thanks for the replied. I'm going to try some differnt things .......


* a few pounds heavier recurve (instead of longbow)
* 3D shoots
* McKensie target to shoot at
* standing instead of seating
* try a pin, what the heck