Hey everyone, LittleTree here, please be suspicious of any and all flu-like symptoms this Spring (Headache, muscle aches, stiff neck, fever/ chills etc). This is my second bout with Lymes in three years. The first time, I wasn't lucky enough to get the bullseye, and had to diagnose with only flu-like symptoms. This year I got the Bull, and got on meds pronto. Please be suspicious!!!! This is stage 1 symptoms, where the disease is easily treatable. Left untreated after the initial symtoms subside, and it morphs to stage two and three, where it can and will change your life for the worse! Be safe and aware...... (http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y4/littletree4/lymesbull.jpg)
Glad your OK and good post!! Everyone can use a reminder and nothing better than a picture which is worth a thousand words!! Shawn
Good post and something for all of us to be aware of. I have a couple friends who have dealt with this and as you say it can change your life.
Good headsup!Go prepared in tick country.I like a tight turtleneck shirt.Tuck your shirt in your pants good and cinch your belt up tight.Tuck your pants in your boots if you can or tape em on tight around ankles.Check yourself often and really look yourself over after the hunt well.Use tick repellants.Preventions the best medicine.
Ouch! Hope your well.
hope everything works out for you, thanks for the reminder, like shawn said the picture says enough
When I worked for the USDA Forest Service in one night I pulled off over thirty embedded seed and deer ticks, no bulleyes, now I always check anything that seems to itch after the hunt, 90% of the time I find them before they bury in and always wear long socks pulled up and lapped over the top of my boots,, At one time I covered my body in permanone due to the frequency of embedded ticks. These days I can not stand the smell or feel of any chemical, resolution have a good looking gal check in those hard to reach spots...regularly after every hunt or outing.
I have Lymes, got bit almost 3 years ago, it never fully leaves your body and at least for me it requires once or twice a year attention.
It would be cavalier for me to say "be careful" because as careful as you can be, you still run the risk of Lymes if you go into those dangerous woods ... or even yer own back yard.
IMO, it's all a matter of Divine destiny, but if yer going afield it sure doesn't hurt to cover up as much as possible, use Permanone presoak on ALL yer outer clothing, step around and away from all low lying vegetation, be very careful where you sit!, do a thorough body strip check after playing in the woods.
Also, Lymes will manifest its presence in many different forms, and the classic bullseye doesn't always occur (didn't for me), and symptoms may not show up for weeks or even months. This is one very very nasty disease, and once bitten you have it for life.
I wish all the best for ya, Brad. Rather than conventional Western medicine, do consider visiting a Naturopathic doc - I did and he literally saved my life, and without using invasive drugs.
does that run down south as well...??? mark
I know a doctor in Alexandria, LA that had it a few years ago. He is not a hunter either. Spends little time in the woods
B.
this picture speaks a thousand words. I never go in the woods without my spandex running tights and long sleeve mock-neck shirt under my hiking/hunting clothes, and I try to remember checking myself in the mirror when I get home. I've been bit a few times, but lucky to find the tick before it worked its way past the skin layers. Glad you'll be OK
I for one know that feeling, I also received a "Bullseye" on the back of my left arm last archery season in Vermont. A visit to a local hospital and two weeks on meds seemed to take care of it. Lucky I guess. A good reminder, take care out there folks. All the best, Carl
Anyone ever had regular ticks (wood ticks we call them here, big ones) leave this red ring as well??
QuoteOriginally posted by hunt it:
Anyone ever had regular ticks (wood ticks we call them here, big ones) leave this red ring as well??
Any tick species can carry Lymes, though specific tick types are the primary carriers in different regions and US states.
Rob,
My son got a wood tick bite way back, 7 years ago and it was a big wood tick. After I got it off he had that big circle for three or four days. He has never had any symtoms and at the time they thought only deer ticks in our area carried lymes. I guess if seven years has gone by with no issues all should be ok. I was just wondering if the ring was normal after any tick bite.
Hunt it.
I would not rely on "after 7 years and no apparent symptoms" as an indicator that everything is OK. It might not be.
Lymes is an insidious disease that manifests itself in lots of different ways...it can kill you brother....do damage to your brain, your heart, your liver, kidneys....everything important to a long life.
It can lay dormant in you for years, then another bite can immediately set it into high gear...very wierd disease that often is masked as something else, or not at all. There are many false positives on the test...so that it is unreliable...its just not a good thing to get.
If it were my son I would get him tested, pronto, and then test him again in a year..and again..after that.
Brad, I did not know or realize we had Lyme disease in our area. I will be headed up to my property that is just 20 min east of Viroqua in a week or so. I will be opening up our place up there.
Hope this clears up!
Regards,
Bill
Heed well everything that Ray just posted. Lymes is a very insidious disease that easily masks itself as something minor, or at least something not at all major. A blood test for Lymes is totally unreliable. It took 9 months and 4 docs to finally diagnose that indeed I had Lymes. The last doc, a naturopath, nailed it within 20 minutes, and taking a multi daily concoction of natural herbs knocked out almost all of my symptoms within 3 weeks. If you've been stuck by a tick, I highly recommend a visit to a naturopath and a Vega computer energy diagnosis.
Once bitten, and once the bug's spirochete juice flows into your veins, you have it for life - there is no known 100% cure for Lymes disease. And make no mistake, Lymes has increased to what I would call epidemic proportions here in the US.
For ground stalking bowhunter's, ticks are more than mini speed bumps to avoid during a day's hunt - they are a serious enemy, and despite their diminutive size are actually hunting us as they perch on a bush leaf two feet off the ground with outstretched probes, just waiting to latch onto a new host meal. Take heed, take care.
Hey BillW, SW Wisconsin is one of the hottest-spots for Lymes in the entire U.S.!!!. We have an enormous population of the Black-legged species which generally carry the disease. I judge the "bad times" by my dog, and how many I pull off of him. I have pulled off over 50 deer ticks off of my dog in one sitting! That is with Frontline tick treatment! And Yes, he does have Lymes. Be careful if you are spending time here in the Spring, and acording to the Experts....it will only get worse from here with global warming. Mild winters do not kill any of them off!
Ticks and Lymes disease has gotten so bad for dogs around here (NJ/NY) that our dog has come down with it at least twice a year for the last 6 years. Dogs show the effects of Lymes within a few dayze and a few week's worth of antibiotics will keep it well in check.
Hey Ray, how's your bud with the Lyme doing? Haven't heard recently.
Serious stuff, folks. May just be the next big epidemic on the horizon. A stunning number of dogs around here are seropositive; I had two today, and one yesterday. My wife was stricken 3 years ago; her physician was convinced she had MS, and it took some serious arm-twisting to get him to test her for Lyme. She responded almost immediately to treatment, but still has some minor residual effects; I doubt it's been totally cleared. She never exhibited the characteristic lesion; in fact, she was not aware of a tick bite at all. It can mimic practically anything; if you're under the weather, get checked; if you're strongly suspicious that you may have it, skip the GPs and run, don't walk, to an infectious disease specialist.
The ring is not normal after just any bite. I have never had one and I have been bit alot. I pulled one tonight that was stuck. Dang I am iching now...
When I was at the UW-Madison, I hunted your area a lot. Lucky not to have gotten anytick bites. Good post in a timely manner.
It is always a good idea to get any bite checked out, and with lyme disease the old saying an ounce of prevention....
Many times with a tick bite, a simple dose of doxycycline or appropriate antibiotic can go a lot further when early treatment is applied rather than waiting. So please heed the warning and if you suspect a tick bite-get seen!
Here is a tick bite I had 3 wks ago
(http://i38.photobucket.com/albums/e136/bigbuckhntr/CID__0403070801.jpg)
Found him stuck in me w/the ring already there!! I thought it came after.Well Im on anti's now twice a day,and had blood work done.When the Dr. looked at it he dismissed it as a tick bite.Said it looked like a spider bite,even after arguing w/him,telling him I pulled it out myself.Saw him the other day and he said no need for a follow up blood test because the antibiotics will take care of it.Boy, I would like to tie him to a tree and shoot him w/dull BH's :knothead:
PETE
Pete! Ride out the antbiotic treatment, take every last one, and find a new doctor, he sounds like an idiot. My bullsye is fading today, and I am feeling better....good luck bud. Brad
Got that bullseye myself after attending an archery shoot near Tulsa OK. I was living in Ak at the time and none of the docs had seen that bullseye before. I finally got treated for it, but it seems as if my muscles are always stiff. I just pass it off as age (48) but now I am wondering...
QuoteOriginally posted by Jim Moore:
... but it seems as if my muscles are always stiff. I just pass it off as age (48) but now I am wondering...
Classic Lymes symptom - you need to treat that ASAP. I highly recommend finding a naturopath that's versed in Lymes disease and a Vega energy computer.
I got the bullseye about 7 years ago from a tick bite. Got the shots the next day. Had blood test six months later and had another blood test after a year. The tests turned out negative so I dodged the bullet that time. It's something that's out there and need to take precautions but it's just part of being in the woods. I'm there since it's part of my job and I enjoy spending time out there, hunting and hiking.
Be aware that blood tests for Lymes disease are totally unreliable and therefore meaningless.
Instead of checking your blood, I suggest having your energy levels compared to known dangerous bacteria, and supplemental antidotes to that bacteria prescribed. The only device I know of that can do this is a Vega energy computer, and it takes a knowledgeable naturopath to do the interpretations and prescribe the proper supplements to kill and/or suppress the bacteria that's hiding in your body joints, masking itself as something other than Lymes.
IMO, antibiotics should always be regarded as a last resort - they can really screw up your system, as can anti-inflammatory drugs (did for me). And each case of Lymes will most likely be unique, requiring special diagnosis and treatment.
For your own sake, don't take any of this lightly, this is really serious lifestyle threatening stuff ...
Rob, isn't the unreliability of the test though, that it shows false-positives...meaning that it shows you have it when you do not, rather than the opposite, which would be showing you don't have it, when you DO?
If that is the case, I would still take the test..
Ray, the real issue is that a blood test for Lymes is a crap shoot. Receiving a negative test result for Lymes, when in fact you DO have Lymes, is not a good thing. I've been in that situation twice already. I will not play Russian roulette with my health.
I see absolutely no justification in getting a Lymes blood test.
After 9 months of pain, 2 negative Lymes blood tests, taking multi doctor prescribed cocktails of anti-inflammatories for a mis-diagnosed "tennis elbow", screwing up my liver during all this nonsense, my symptoms only getting worse, finally my wife ("Miss Wildcat", and aptly name - right Terry? ;) ) dragged me hollering and kicking to a naturopath and within 3 weeks I was well on my way to remission (NOT a cure - there is no cure).
interesting...so its not just false positives???
Wow. Ken Swann and you should write a book on Lymes. His experience sounds as complicated as yours.
Then on the other side of the spectrum is my best friend...who sought out experts in NY, CT, and Charlotte, NC who were renowned for their work with Lymes disease...and after two years of taking IV antibiotics and destroying his immune system and not getting better his other friends and I convinced him to go to Mayo. They kept him for 30 days the first time..and a couple weeks a second time.
They determined he did not ever have Lymes..no markers in his body for it at all...and that it was an odd neurological problem. He is now much better...not over it, but much better.
Rob, out of curiosity, what was it the ND had you on? I would understand your hesitation to post the stuff as I understand that each person in different. My episode was back in '03.
Ray, I'll add a caveat to all I've said so far - the naturopath I went to was my Lymes savior, and I have no idea if his actions to "cure" me was borne of supreme knowledge, luck, a fluke, or a miracle of divine intervention. All I can say is, the herbal supplement remedies worked extremely fast and well for me. With an ND, there's nothing to lose but money - no part of the remedy process will harm your body.
Jim, there was a whole litany of different supplements and dosages I took, many times per day and under very specific conditions. It was really intense for the first month. And as the process progressed the supplement types and dosages were changed, based on my energy and bug level readouts. Again, all I can say is that I followed the prescriptions religiously ... and after over a year of intense joint pain, and not being able to draw and hold a 30# bow I'm now totally pain free and back to shooting my 55# bow with amazing ease. I could be a poster boy for an ND Lymes success - if it wasn't such a serious matter I might be laughing, but Lymes is no laughing matter - at least to me. I've got a checkup scheduled for next week, I'll collect the supplement names that I'd taken and let ya know.
Are there any "HOMEOPATHIC REPELLANTS" one could use? Specifically for that Disease? Or something to give Us a Little Edge over the Nasty Little Monsters just to Stump or Wander in the Woods? I have had My Eyes OPENED to Nature,Wives Tales,or Whatever you want to call it.
Some of them "Old Wives" were Pretty Darn Sharp!! I take "Dandelion Capsules", 2 Caps 3X a Day to help Cleanse my Liver from ALL the Painkillers I have taken and still take. Hey, I figure it Cant Hurt, Right?? :archer:
I've not heard of anything that will guard against Lymes before being infected. But I'll check that out with my ND next week.
I do a body detox about twice per year - it helps in many ways, and for many things including Lymes. Right now I'm doing a liver detox along with daily juicing - no question, it really perks up my energy levels and no caffeine is involved.
Now, I'm sure someone's gonna question the validity of this thread here on PowWow - "Hey Rob, this has nothing to do with trad bowhunting, why is it still here and why are YOU posting on it?"
My retort is that trad bowhunting is a lifestyle to most of us and we wouldn't want it any other way. Lymes will shorten or stop a trad bowhunter's lifestyle in almost a heartbeat, and will forever change your life. As hunters, our milieu - the woods - is the same as a tick's, and they are hunting us at the same time we are hunting our prey. I consider this thread as a necessary public safety document for all trad bowhunters (actually, for anyone that treads tick territory).
I don't want to get into an arguement about "natural remedies" compared to pharmacologic treatment - if you've used a naturopath and feel well, then no harm done (probably).
But I'd be willing to bet that it had nothing to do with curing Lyme disease.
This is a well studied and very serious disease - it is an infection by Borrelia burgdorferi transmitted by 2 specific tick species - Ixodes scapularis and ixodes pacificus.
There are specific tests that CAN reveal the presence of Lyme disease, but your physician must order the correct tests - and I agree completely, if he/she doesn't take your concerns seriously, you should find another physician. The serum testing may not be needed in classic examples (like the pic above)
PLEASE if you have a rash like you saw in the picture (that is a classic example) go to a PHYSICIAN - there are no studies showing effective treatment of Lyme disease with homeopathic/herbal/vitamin supplements etc - it requires treatment with ANTIBIOTICS.
I'm not trying to target Rob specifically - and I agree that most herbal remedies are harmless UNLESS they cause you to delay appropriate and proven treatment. So if you want to use an herbal cocktail, use it as a chaser for your doxycycline.
Thought this map might be helpful - pretty self-explanatory
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v408/tjvanben/riskmap_ld.gif)
Jason,
I have absolutely no reason to debate you as an MD, nor have I any reason defend my ND. I can only speak from my personal experiences and there is NO question in my mind that herbal supplements put my Lymes into almost immediate remission - it was that dramatic a reversal of symptoms. This is after 9 months of taking the Western medicine approach, which included incorrect diagnosis, antibiotic cocktails and liver wracking anti inflammatory drugs. Add to this that initially I thought the ND and supplement approach would be a total waste of my time and money and my outlook was that this was "voodoo medicine" - so I definitely approached my ND with a ton of skepticism. I freely admit I was as wrong as my physicians. These dayze, for some ailments, before resorting to antibiotics, I'll at least try the homeopathic route first. For the most part, they've worked very effectively, at least for me.
I am not going to Discount ANYTHING anymore, so Do What You Must, But DO SOMETHING!
TTT