I am shooting a 56" 55#@28 in Chek-mate Attila. I have only been shooting for a few weeks. Probably shot about 400 arrows so far. When I draw back the bow, I can pull it straight back with my arm straight ahead. After warming up, I can put 5 of 6 arrows into a 5in. circle size area from 10 yards and a paper plate from 15 yards.
However, here are my concerns. When I pull back my arms will shake quite a bit. Also, my ring finger is getting sore. I switched from a tab to a glove and am still having the problem. I am shooting split finger. If I pull back and release immediately, i don't shake, and my accuracy doesn't really suffer. If I sit there and try to "aim" I start to shake.
Am I overbowed? If so, am I close enough that I should just keep at it and practice and conditioning will fix it, or should I try to get a lighter bow?
Thanks in advance!!
Two things, if the ring finger is getting sore you are using that finger too much, the string should be distributted with even pressure on all three fingers. Second you have to use your back muscles, sounds like you are only using your arms to pull the bow. You should be able to pull the bow and hold for a few seconds,2-5, without shaking. Nothing wrong with releasing when you hit anchor as long as you get a solid anchor. Look at what you want to hit and release. Have fun.
Danny
I think practice and conditioning could greatly improve any archer, shooting any poundage bow.With that said I think you could build up to it. Give it a little time and if your not moving closer to where you want to be than go down.
Well first off, I AM NO EXPERT. I would guess that you may be overbowed? Shaking is a dead giveaway. I am overbowed @ 50#, therefore im going down to 40#. My goal is to engrain repeatable form, comfortably.(jmo) Hopefully someone with more experience will chime in. Good luck to ya, and keep us posted.
Steve.
Well, yeah, you are overbowed. So what to do about it? Not everybody can master a 55 pound bow, even over a period of years. If you are young and sturdily built you could try. Otherwise just sell the bow and start over. The best way is to start with a target bow in the low to mid 30s. They are inexpensive used on ****. Once you master that, over a year or two, you can can move up to hunting weight, 45 to 50 pounds, adequate for large deer, black bear and elk.
Few men on the planet can master more than 50 pounds. They simply can't shoot enough thousands of arrows without breaking down in form.
Most any good bowyer could take your present bow down to 50 pounds, but I would still shoot a lighter bow for a year or so.
As to the ring finger. Sounds like you are drawing with your finger tips. It is much better to take a deeper hook on the string. Past the first joint on the middle finger, in the joint on the other two fingers.
First,what is your draw length? You could be overbowed because with only 400 shots in a few weeks it would seem so.Your strength will increase fast but you don't want to learn bad habits from too much weight. I would say keep your bow for later but pick up a 35 or 40lb to learn with.If money is an issue you should be able to get a used Bear or Pearson or some other under $100.Your accuracy will improve when Shooting is so much fun you will shoot 100 arrows in a day and not be worn out.
Try a 45 pound bow. You would be surprised how much difference there is. If that works without shaking, shoot that one for a while. I don't know that I would sell the 55 just yet. If the 45 works, warm-up with that one, then try a few shots with the 55. Don't overdo it, stay under ten shots, less would be better. You may find that you shoot the 55 pretty well.
When I am practicing, I always warm-up with a lighter bow, usually my 45, then work up to the 55. I find I shoot much better with all of them when I do this. Make no mistake, a 55 pound bow is pretty stout. As longbowguy said, mastering it takes some doing. Work on the form with the lighter bow.
If the 45 pound bow is too heavy, the take longbowguy's advice and work up from target weight to hunting weight bows. My 45 pound bow would kill anything I am likely to shoot, but the same arrows sure do get there faster out of my 55!
Hope this helps.
Thanks everyone. Let me address some of your replies.
Longbowguy, your comment about using my fingertips was right on. I had thought that I would get a cleaner release by trying to get closer to the tips of my fingers. I will try with a deeper hold.
I have a buddy who will let me borrow a 40-45 lb bow and I can work with that for a while. I am a pretty big guy(read 280lb), and can hold for probably 1-2 seconds without shaking.
When I pick up my son's 28lb bow, I can hold it all day. It just doesn't get the arrows out there the same way at all. I am sure there is something I can learn from that bow as far as form goes.
Danny, I will work on more even pressure. Thank you.
RH Clark, 400 shots isn't due to only being able to shoot 20 arrows per day, it is due to spring weather here in Oregon (read rain). when I do go out shooting, I shoot about 70-90 arrows per session.
All being said, I know I can't afford more than one bow. If I do go down, I want it to be at least 45#, so I can hunt at least deer with it. I will see if I can shoot a bow of that weight at the local shop and see if that helps.
I find that when I use my back muscles, I end up with a straighter bow arm and the string hits my forearm. I bend my elbow out, but I have to have a more open stance. I feel like there is less back musckle and more shoulder with the more open stance. Am I right on this?
I started out with a 50# longbow, that turned out to be too much. I went down to a 48# longbow that i can shoot better recently i started shooting a 46# recurve compared to the others it feels like i can hold it back all day. You would be surprised how much different and easier it is to shoot just a 4# drop in weight.
Keep the bow. I started out with a 50 then jumped to a 60 soley because I was told you needed a 60# bow to legally hunt moose in New Hampshire. It took a little getting use too but now it fels every bit as comfortable as that 50 did. But if you just want to hunt whietail then 45 is OK though.
David, You are without a doubt overbowed 55#'s is way too much for anyone just starting out. This is archery not weight lifting... you will not get stronger by shooting that bow you will only develop very bad habits, and end up with an injury. If you think you are having trouble now just try and draw that bow back on a cold day with a buck in front of you.
You really need to go down in weight and develop good form or you will never give youself a chance excell in this sport. I would start with a 35#-40# bow, and 40#'s with a well placed shot will handle deer sized game. I have been shooting for well over 30 years, and have seen many people make this mistake.
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David--Are you a former compound shooter? The way you describe "aiming and holding" and your bow arm and stance lead me to believe you were. You should be able to use your back and bend your bow arm. A good many longbow shooters cant the bow and lean over the arrow. You might try searching for form pics here on trad gang in the Pow Wow or Shooters Forum for some examples.
Whether you are overbowed (the vast majority of beginners would be at 55#) is somewhat relative to how many arrows you shoot in a session. If your groups get bigger with practice rather than smaller, your form is probably slipping. The real danger in being overbowed (aside from shoulder injury) is developing poor form. When your accuracy starts to fade, stop that session.
I shoot with a tab and the tips of my fingers and early in the season if I shoot extensively, my ring finger gets sore too. I may have less than perfect form. I have a suspicion that I torque the string a little rather than pulling the string straight in it's axis (my fingers incorrectly at a different degree of cant than the bow). Anyway, as the season progresses, I get some callous on the fingertips and they cease to be sore from shooting.
If you can borrow that lighter bow, I would do it. I would think a guy of your size could work up to the 55# fairly easily. Stone knife is right--4 lbs is a big difference.
Thanks all again. I think I will borrow that lighter bow. Surprisingly, my first 15-20 arrows are the worst. After that, my shooting is pretty consistent up to about 70 arrows. I think my muscles get warmed up and then it is fine. I definitely shake earlier rather than later in my shooting sessions. I think I may be torqueing the string as well.
I don't have any callouses on my "delicate fingers". Got an office job. :biglaugh:
Your 55 bow is a good workout tool...draw the bow several times a day in the house and hold until you can't hold any longer.
Scott, Size has nothing to do with how strong a person is, so to say he should be able to work up to 55#'s fairly easy is far from true. Also 55#'s is not where most beginners are at most beginners can't draw 50#'s and shoot well. I don't know any beginner who can draw, and hold that kind of weight, and shoot with any consistant accuracy.
It is all about form, and trying to shoot this weight from the start will only hurt your form, and not allow you to develop the form needed to become a well rounded archer....
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The "deep hook" release will work different muscles. This will make a difference. Try something different on your practice. Shoot only 6 to 10 arrows then stop. Wait an hour or so before shooting again. If you can do this all day you can get your practice in but you will be fresh everytime. You'll improve. If you are shooting 70 arrows, the last 50 to 60 are not helping you.
Prarrie Dog
Scott, your not overbowed if you can consistantly hit what you are aiming at, let your body develop the strength needed to pull the bow and just contiue to shoot, you will get stronger the more you shoot.
I would love to be able to shoot all day long, but alas, other stuff to do. PrarrieDog, If my last 50-60 are going where I want them, isn't that what we want? I am going to try the deep hook and we'll see what happens. I love the bow and would prefer to find a way to make this one work.
Deerslayer, I am well-rounded!!!! :bigsmyl:
Hey at 6'1" 290lbs I'm well rounded too. :biglaugh:
Have You tried Shooting 3 Under? That and a Good Cordovan Tab will ease the Numbness in your Finger!
Thats doesnt MEAN you shouldnt Shoot with a "Deep Hook", they can make some Big Tabs, because if I am guessing Correctly, Your Digits arent Real Small.
Nothing Wrong with that, and I agree You are Over-Bowed, but Practicing and getting your Form in Order with the 40# Bow will Help Your "Self-Confidence" as well!!
Dont Give Up!!Good Luck to Ya Sir!
David, one thing I don't think anyone mentioned regarding the sore third finger--that can be caused by raising the drawing arm elbow too high which puts uneven pressure on the bottom of your finger and can cause it to be sore. I have a buddy who can look at a guys third finger and tell by the callous in most cases if he raises his elbow instead of keeping it in line with the forearm. Just a thought you may want to take a look at. You may or may not be overbowed. If you can draw and hold the bow with good control, the shaking will subside as you build up to the weight a bit more....Dave
you're overbowed...go to 35-40 limbs and concetrate on your form...accuracy will follow and you will be able to increase in draw weight poundage as time goes
You can probably get where you can shoot the bow.I do believe that it will take you much longer to learn to shoot good and you will have a hard time breaking all the bad habits you are going to develope from starting out with a short heavy bow.I did the same thing and as far as I am concerned I wasted two years.Get a longer,light weight bow and you will cut the learning curve to a 1/4 of the time and will be much better off in the long run. jmho
I say it depends on your strength and condition. I have a bud who can bench 400#s and when he started it was with a 60# bow, he was not overbowed. If you can hold for 3-5 seconds comfortably than you are probably not overbowed. You do not have to hold long at all to shoot well though, as long as you have asolid anchor point, hit it and let it fly. Shawn
David, when I switched from a compound to a recurve I was thinking I needed a heavier bow than I should use, having come from a 72# compound. When I started shooting a recurve I quickly found that I couldn't shoot one at anywhere near that poundage. I wish I would have received this kind of info. back then. It is a good idea, like some have indicated, to start out with a poundage that is manageable, that you can shoot with a controlled and steady hand. That way you will develop good form and not bad habits. I read in a trad. magazine that a large percentage of archers start out being over- bowed.
I'll second that ,when I started shooting again in the late 90s I bought a 50# Hill style long bow and went at it.I knew from past experience I could handle 50# ,hey I more in high school. Wrong,2 things ,I draw 30" and the bow stacked like a demon.I was drawing over 60# and could't hit nothin.Finall figured out that problem and traded for a true 50#@30 bow,big difference.That was a trade of convience because the upper limb was twisted on the hill style and I traded with a local bowyer who could fix it. What I did was get out my old Browning Cobra II and shoot it for a while. Lond winded way to say check the bow @ your draw length,If you draw long it might be best to go ahead and trade for another bow.This forum is great ,wish I had known bout it in 95,would have saved me lots of grief.But I guess the hard learned lessons last!
If you can't hold the bow back for 2-3 seconds without a lot of shaking.... you're overbowed. Get control of the bow, don't let it control you and how you shoot. Lighter and longer will be a quicker road to shooting well.
Thanks everyone. I have listed it for trade in the classifieds. We'll see what happens.
Just one more thing to add. Byron Ferguson, in a recent article- TBM. Said if you can't pull back and hold for 10 seconds you are probably overbowed.
I went out and shot tonight with some tips from Molson. Got everything lined up a little better and was able to hold steady for 3-4 seconds. I was shooting it pretty true where I was aiming. I think I may have figured it out. I took a deeper finger hook and rolled my elbow out more like Molson suggested. I felt a lot more steady. Thank you all for your help!!
I would suggest that you keep your eyes open for a lighter poundage bow. I would do this to fine tune your form. Also would serve as a back up bow.
I have a 28 lb recurve that my son shoots. It feels like a toy after shooting my bow. I do use it to pull and work on form. Is that what you meant?
You have some good advice on here, but I would like to add one thing if you really want to improve. Start reading some archery "how to" books and looking at some good video's. Ferguson, Kidwell, Thompson, Ford and others are good places to start reading and H. Hill, Masters of the barebow and Shulz's video's are also good starting points. As you read and look at them, look for what they do in common. That is usually a good thing. On the videos play it in slow motion and see what they all do. I think you will find that deep hooks, solid anchor, back tension are pretty common for "good" archers. Then you will start to see how everything is related. For example; You don't need to worry much about shooting left or right if you are using a deep hook, proper back tension and a natural anchor along with a solid placement of your face on your pulling hand. (This example is an example and doesn't constitute the sum of what is required to be a competent archer. I know there is a lot more involved.)
You could be overbowed i am not sure.I weigh 150 lbs and stand 5 foot 7 inches tall with a 26.5 inch draw lenght.I have been shooting traditionl bows since the age of 8 years old,33 now.Never touched a compound until 2 years ago just to see what it was like.Didnt like it at all.I was shooting over 50lbs at 15 years old,today my bows are as follows at my draw 59lbs,60,61,63,65 and 77lbs.I shoot all these bows well and dont feel overbowed one bit.But i snap shoot,when i reach full draw and my middle finger touches my mouth the arrow is gone.If i try to hold i shake,i can hold 2 to three second without shaking.Holding is not my shooting style and never will be,this dosent bother me one bit.You mentioned that you shoot well with this style.Why change that and try to hold if you dont have to?Or is it something you just want to be able to do.I can only attribute my own abilities to shoot heavy bows due to years of conditioning archery muscles and my style of shooting,i am a small guy and freak people out on a regular basis with the weights i accuratly shoot,i think with time you can shoot your 55lb bow real good to.I also shoot with the tips of my fingers and find they only get sore if i dont shoot much,when i am shooting all the time they calus up and theres no problum,when i am shooting my heavier bows i anchor a little deeper into the string cause it just feels right.I would borrow your buddies bow and give it a try,but i wouldnt give up on that 55 lber,with practice and condtioning it should be no problum for ya.Goodluck.By the way if i try to hold my accuracy suffers,so i just dont and dont worry about it.
My wife says im over bowed,i told her i would sell some! :archer: :cool: :rolleyes: