Hey guys, what are your thoughts on these kinetic bows (Dalla or Master). Tonight is the first night that I have read anything about them. Most of their reviews are excellent.
well they arent kind to the wallet,
but they do look awsome!!!
I own a Dalaa and have shot a Master. Whats not to like? LOL!!!
They are DEAD in the hand on the shot, very stable, and the kicker for me, SMOOTH AS BUTTER ON THE DRAW CYCLE!!!!!! Mine gains about 1.75-2# per inch out to 30". They are very tunable either shot off the shelf or a rest and plunger. They allow you to play with shooting 3 under or split by the adjustable tiller.
Guys are going to tell you they are HEAVY, but actually they are lighter than several takedown non metal risered recurves I have owned and shot, (Black Widow, Palmer, and a few others come to mind off the bat).
Others will tell you that they are COLD, but they have a wood grip, and somehow the guys shooting those wheeled bows ALL have managed to make it o.k. in the cold without having their hands stick to the risers.
Some will say they are not traditional, but Metal risered recurves have been around longer than I have been alive and back when archery was just that archery, they were thought of as just another recurve.
There are a few that will chime in and say, "THEY ARE JUST NOT FOR ME!!!" These are the guys that somehow feel threatened by Metal risers and seek these threads out to make their position known so they can hold their ground. LOL!!! I think we ALL figured it out the 10th time they stated that! HA HA HA!!
Others will say they are loud, and I have NO CLUE where they are coming from. I have some wool yarn wrapped around the string where the string touches the limb (Poor man's Bowhush) and one set of BW spider silencers and it is QUIET. BTW I have been shooting a Winter Dart league with very light arrows and it is still QUIET!!!! That is with a 10 strand 8125 padded loop string too!
Is a DAS for you?? I don't know, but you owe it to yourself to shoot one and see. I wasn't real interested until I had one in my hand and after the first shot, I HAD TO HAVE ONE!! It is the only recurve I own, and those that know me, know I have owned SEVERAL and many at the same time.
If you get past the prejudices against them by a very small minority and try one, you might like it, or you might not.
Just to give you a platform to see where I am coming from. I love longbows and own SEVERAL. I build Bamboo Backed Trilam bows as well. I have a spliced Billet Osage Selfbow almost done, and I am even going to be building some cane arrows soon, so you see I LOVE every aspect and facet of archery. The DAS is just another wonderful facet of this great sport for me.
There might be someone in NC with one you could try out.
God Bless
All my research has only turned up favorable information, sounds like about the best there is out there. So......... I just ordered one yesterday, sheepishly told my wife and she just laughed, knew I couldn't control myself. I will let you all know how it shoots in a couple of days! :bigsmyl:
I can't add much to Carbon Caster's post. I own a Master and I absolutely love it. I really lends itself to being shot well. They are definitely one of the best bows on the market.
Shoot one and you'll see what we mean.
I own a Master and I second what Carbon said. You honestly will not find a finer shooting recurve...Period.
One of the DAS riser's finest attributes IMHO is that you don't have to rely on a bowyer ever, to make you extra limbs, all you need is the bushings from DAS and they are I believe $20.00. Easily pressed in.
Limbs are available everywhere and when you want them from older ILF limbs that are better than most bowyers limbs, available for a song on the second hand market to state of the art foam carbon limbs used by todays top olympic archers.
K9Jones,
I must apologize for ruining what could have been an enjoyable thread. I went and put the truth up before false assumptions could be made. LOL!!!!
Let us know if you shoot one and what YOU think, because that is all that REALLY matters.
Carbon Caster said it. They are the most accurate bows I've shot...very fast as well.
Keep in mind that some traditional shoots won't allow them because they aren't shot off the shelf and they are metal risered. I am not trying to start a war here; I simply want to make sure that folks are informed as to the pros and cons regarding a purchase.
Functionally speaking, they are excellent. I will probably get flamed for this but I find the metal riser to be kind of boring (probably a mental hangup from my old compound days). If you can get past the metal riser and olympic style limbs, they are incredible. I have tried but have been unsuccessful to date.
I shoot mine off the shelf, and I don't know of any shoot that wouldn't let you use a metal risered recuve, not saying there aren't any. It wouldn't bother me anyway, cause I bought it to hunt with.
You can stick a $2 plastic rest on a classic wooden recurve and it will not be legal at some shoots although the bow came equiped with a rest when new. :) You can shoot the DAS with or without one if you wish.The piece of plastic is the deciding factor at any shoot.Not the bow.
OKCtradguy, I was also hung up on the metal riser and thought about it, Metal has been on this planet longer than wood. Not trying to flame you at all. So I am purchasing a Dalaa to find out for myself it it works for me.
If one sticks to purely selfbows scratched out with home made hand tools that is as basic as you can get, anything above this is a compromise you make to have a better weapon, question becomes where do you draw the line. That is a personal question each has to answer for themselves.
Sorry about going in a tangent, have read many good things on the Das/Dalaa and can not wait to try one out.
The DAS Dalaa can be shot with an elevated rest OR off the shelf. I shoot mine off the shelf and would not have bought one if an elevated rest had been obligatory. (That's just me.)
Never heard of a shoot that disqualifies or discourages metal risers. If someone can show me evidence to the contrary, I'd be interested.
Mark
I have 3 sets of limbs now for my Dalaa, 35#-45#-55#. This allows adjustments from 33#-58# with one bow. I shoot off the shelf, just prefer that for now. The bow is not the end all be all, it just does most things better than others. It increases ones potential, doesnt make you a better shooter. As to 3D shoot allowances, well see what they let me do as the shoots start next week. I plan on being at Sisspahah(Near Burilington) next Saturday,with my Dalaa.
Estacado
I shot Greybeards at the EOBH here in Brockville Ont.I have to say it was on the boarder of too high tech for me but that is strictly for me.
If you were to ask me if I could say one bad thing about that bow or the way it shot ,I would have to say there was nothing bad about it.It shot smooth,fast and felt good in the hand and I did not find it heavy.
All that said ,I stiil love the feel of a wood riser in my hand.
To each their own.
How do you think the bow is priced????
I have the DAS Dalaa in 55#, and agree that it's a joy to shoot. Shooting a 2115 arrow with a 125 grain point, I seem to get about 177 fps, which is about the same as for other comparable hi-end recurve bows, i.e. my Black Widow. In other words, there doesn't seem to be any great advantage, if any, in arrow speed. Is this what others have found?
Price-wise, the bow from Three Rivers is priced somewhat less than my Black Widow, and certainly performs as well. I would guess that the BW has more work in it, particularly in the riser, since I wouldn't think there is much work to making a Dalaa riser once the design part has been done. But if your criteria is performance, who really cares if the bow was made by snapping your fingers, right?
I have a DAS Master and it is absolutley dead in the hand, as vibration free as possible and quiet with minimal silencing accessories, far less than what I have had to put on some longbows.
It isn't a board bow, it isn't a Hill bow, it isn't a R/D long bow, and it isn't a high fashion recurve.
It is a bow, a pure recurve, which provides a significant choice to an archer/hunter to have an excellent opportunity to maximaze their skills and abilities in shooting a stickbow. It is not for everybody. Just as an osage selfbow isn't for everyone.
Is it the most expensive bow on the market? By far it is not. I have seen some high dollar bows that are cut on power machinery that other than finish, I'd bet the DAS bows demand the same level of handiwork.
If you want a bow to hunt with, to shoot targets with, to rove (stump shoot) with, it is a top choice. But there are other excellent bows as well.
Before you decide yea or nay, if at all possible, shoot one.
Guys, I have had plenty of chances to shoot the bows at 3 Rivers with all kinds of combos of limbs. Yes they are very fast and quiet and dead in the hand. I just can't hit where I am looking with them. They are just not for me. They are nice and if they make you a better shot then I think that is great. I wish I could shoot them because I shot right beside guys that were grouping inside a Skoal can but I just couldn't do it. They are nice. Wish you all well.
I bought an Alpine Soft Loc bow quiver to go with the Dalaa. I haven't hunted with it yet, but it seems like a nice, quiet quiver. However, when I load the arrows, it tends to slip out of its soft lock holder, and I have to pop it back in before I shoot. Has this bothered anyone else, and if so, what have you done about it?
Randy: I have my family roots in NC so I will not tell you untruths. I have been at this archery thing for well over 50 years. In all then time I have only shot bows that I considered to be the best that I could find/afford. The DAS bows (Dalaa is the same bow from 3 Rivers) is just the best hunting bow I have ever shot in all that time. I've killed a bunch of stuff with it since I got one two years ago and my wife, who shoots one in the 43-46# range has put arrows thru deer and bear with them. They are the Cadillac of hunting bows and shine in every department that has to do with performance. Simply put....the best hunting bow on the market unless you have to have a wood riser.
Thanks guys for all the replys. I would like to shoot one some day. I mainly did this post for a friend that is in the market for a recurve. I personally own a black widow, and I am satisfied with its performance, but came across the Dalaa in a post, and found it very interesting. If I was looking for another bow, the Dalaa or Master may be my pick.
I have a Dalaa. It is one of my favorites. I have set the tiller to even. It is the only bow I have ever had that I could shoot off the shelf split finger or string walking from the same nocking point. I have three set of limbs for mine too. they give me form 33# draw to 55#. the limbs that are on the bow most of the time are a pair for Hpyt carbon/foam longs that at set to 44# at my draw. 3D, indoor 300, squirrel hunting, white tail hunting......it just don't get no better :)
rusty
Well said Carbon Caster.........
I have a Dalaa with Three sets of limbs, Two camo in 50# @ 28 X 60"and 60# @ 28X 62" and a set of short ILF conversion Carbons that are great out of a blind 60# @ 28 X 58" I absolutely love mine.
Caarbon Caster has it right!!!
One thing to consider with the DAS/Dalaa is that performance is dependant on limb choice. There is a wide variety of available limbs with varying methods and components of consruction.
I would suspect that a set of Border HexV limbs would absolutely smoke out the DAS. The KAP Carbons have plenty of performance though and cost a whole lot less. I have W&W Focus carbon limbs and some Samick Agulla carbons and they are both smooth, stable and fast. (although the Agullas seem to have the edge)
They are very good bows. The adjustability gives alot of tuning options, especially for carbons. Since carbons have such a wide spread between sizes that adjustability comes in handy. Shoots dead in the hand and as quick as any top shelf recurve. It's very quiet on the shot. It can be shot off the shelf or with a flipper/plunger. The grip is replaceable so that you can experiment with grip designs. The limbs are the best I've ever seen in terms of torsional stability. You just can't torque the tips on the limbs. The availibility of new and used limbs is staggering. Any ILF limb will fit the bow with only a change of the bushings. The prices of limbs both new and used are very reasonable. And you are not locked into a bowyer when you want a new set of limbs.
When I purchased my Dalaa I had 4 wooden bows left, all of which stacked to some degree as I have a 32" draw. In fact I had just recently broken one of my long bows while coming to full draw. As it is next to impossable to to find a good used bow with my specs I has been talking to custom bowyer about having a bow built that would actually fit me. I was having a hard time decideing on what type of bow I was willing to pay that kind of money for, would I be best served with a longer lighter bow for everyday shooting, or should I go ahead and order a heavier weight bow in my preferred hunting weight with shorter limbs? There was also the issue of the 10-12 week waiting period,,, and bear season is approaching. I had looked at the DAS bows but was very sceptacle that anyone could make a 62" bow that wouldn't stack badly at 32", wouldn't have severe finger pinch and end up being an unstable shooter. After talking with several reputable people with long draw lengths who had DAS bows I went ahead and took the plunge. The absolute genius of this bow is it's ability to be set up in such a way that it can make the best use of a limbs power stroke to fit each persons individual draw length,,, even out to my 32". I have two sets of limbs about 8 lbs difference in weight that are both so smooth that after I first put the heavy's on I was thinking I had gone too light. I don't have a chrono but I'm pretty sure that 64lbs at 32" dl will take care of any of my hunting requirements. I ended up selling a Hoyt Tiburon that also had carbon limbs and silencing upgrades on it as there really was no comparison. The Dalaa is definately in a class of it's own when it comes to short hunting bows, quiet, smooth as butter, and cheap when you consider the used limb availabilty,,, and with the word getting out resale is definately not an issue. Best bow investment I've made to date.
They are DEAD in the hand on the shot, very stable, and the kicker for me, SMOOTH AS BUTTER ON THE DRAW CYCLE!!!!!! Mine gains about 1.75-2# per inch out to 30". They are very tunable either shot off the shelf or a rest and plunger. They allow you to play with shooting 3 under or split by the adjustable tiller. these are very tuneable I have paper tuned the master I have to a bullett hole
Guys are going to tell you they are HEAVY, but actually they are lighter than several takedown non metal risered recurves I have owned and shot, (Black Widow, Palmer, and a few others come to mind off the bat). The DAS master that I have is lighter than 60% of other bows.
Others will tell you that they are COLD, but they have a wood grip, and somehow the guys shooting those wheeled bows ALL have managed to make it o.k. in the cold without having their hands stick to the risers. I have hunted with Mine and there are no worries here the wood grip will not allow your have to stick to it like a child licking a metal lightpole in -40 degree weather.
This is my #1 go to bow the secong is a Border Black Douglas with hex 4 limbs
shoot it before yo buy it .
I am in Chicago your welcome to shoot mine any time
Bill
Carbon Caster said it all
I've shot a couple and have to admit they are smooth, dead in the hand and fast for their draw weight (efficient) BUT...
My wood/glass longbows are way lighter and they're very purdy.
I don't mean for this question to come across the wrong way, but;
Given that they are of similar weight and visual appeal, What practical advantage does a kinetic bow have over the latest (relatively light & quiet) compounds that are coming out?
"What practical advantage"
That depends on what puts a smile on your face.Folks need to do that and not worry about the silly stuff.No bow is all that for everybody includieng the wheel bows I'd sudgest trying as many as you can certain things will apeal to each of us and from there you'll have narrowed down the choice's but not eliminated them,there's still a good many bower's to choose from.The DAS is a fine bow for sure but ya still outta try it for yourself to see how it feels to you
Good answer - makes sense. How about the rest of yas?
Please forgive my getting slightly off topic. I need help.
I recently acquired a Dalaa riser for which I have been seeking foam core/carbon extra short limbs -- for a 56-inch OAL bow on 17-inch Dalaa riser. These are just not available ANYWHERE in 39-44# Dalaa draw weight @ 28 inches.
I queried on TradTalk for ILF extra short limbs. To make a long story less long, Border Archery will make limbs. They have eight different model variations. I have neither seen Borders limbs, nor know anyone who has shot them. But I have read only good things about their products' quality.
Since this is a lifetime investment, cost differences among the limbs is irrelevant.
Smoothness and stability between zero degrees and 70 Fahrenheit is more important than fps.
Here are the limbs available.
(http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d106/Naphtalitlk/BorderArcheryILFlimbs.jpg)
Have you checked the olympic archery site's?Those guys should know more about the limbs than most folks here includeing myself.I assume ya asked Dave Sosa the maker of the riser but even then the top target guys may have more to offer.Limbwalker may be able to help not sure if he comes here often but having made the olympic team he may be able to help.He likes his DAS for hunting and has been around the top target archer's too
Swampbuck:
I decided: In for a dime; in for a dollar. I'll order HEX5-H limbs, not because of any special knowledge, but because there's less than $150 difference among the H-series synthetic cored limb sets.
Sid assures me while the improvement in limb efficiency is incremental, HEX5-H is significantly more consistent than the earlier H-series limbs throughout its draw range, at all temperatures, especially as limbs become shorter. It also offers speed improvement. Speed is not a factor in my choice, but it's nice that it's there.