what is your preference and why? I have only owned recurves in the short time that I have done this. I do have the desire own a long bow as well. I don't have any reason for owning only recurves. I really don't know what the differences are as far as shooting and hunting with one or the other..Any insight would great.
Longbow. I prefer a lower wrist grip, like lower toned thump, prefer the draw and release cycle.
That said I own, hunt with and kill with both so it's something you'll have to work with and try out for yourself.
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Quote from: GCook on September 11, 2019, 01:04:19 PM
Longbow. I prefer a lower wrist grip, like lower toned thump, prefer the draw and release cycle.
That said I own, hunt with and kill with both so it's something you'll have to work with and try out for yourself.
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How is the Bear Montana for hunting and shooting?
I started w longbows in the 70s than by 80s had only recurves. Few years back I switched again. I like longbows much better. They're quieter. Don't vibrate after the shot. I'd never go back I don't think
I have both recurve and longbows, but have developed a preference for the longbow.
They are , (to me), smoother, quieter, much easier to stringI have plans to sell off my recurves.
I like them both. Each has it's pros and cons but for the most part I think they are pretty even. I especially like my great northern ghost, which is kind of the best of both worlds. Longbow grip with recurve speed.
I've come to love R/D longbows as I find them to be the best of both worlds, especially for hunting. Quieter than a recurve, easy to push-pull string and in reality, comparable performance.
Trenton, I currently shoot a great northern ghost..it is simple but beautiful piece of wood
I advocate shooting with an arrow rest for all three under shooters. The added forgiveness of tuning to an elevated rest helps to be able shoot with a more parallel arrow and the added height helps to keep the limbs more in time. Not sure if the shape of the limbs has as much to do with it as the shape of the sight widow, a raised arrow rest can cause issues with longbow sight windows. My three under friend now swears to the use of elevated arrows rests, no porpoising arrow flight.
I never shot with a rest on a trad bow. In fact I don't anyone around that does. Heck, not many around shoot traditional bows period!
I have 1 recurve and 7 longbows. I'm partial to longbows myself. It's what I prefer. No fear of limb twist with a longbow.
Quote from: Vabowman on September 11, 2019, 01:12:51 PM
How is the Bear Montana for hunting and shooting?
To your first question r/d longbow hands down. As to the why is simple. Recurves and longbows with no reflex deflex (rd) have advantages and disadvantages. For basic example recurves can generate a lot of speed (as can longbows) however can be prone to limb twist due to the thinness of their limbs. Straight limb longbows might have lower speeds because the limb profile is less efficient and can have more hands shock. However, longbows normally have thicker limbs making them less prone to limb twist and more forgiving of bad form. Byron Ferguson talks about this in one of his videos where he shows himself drawing off the line of the bow and explaining how the limbs pull the string back in line. Of course this is a basic basic overview and by no means comprehensive. With all that said the rd longbow as others have said is the best of both worlds and of the 7 bows I own 5 are rd longbows (my 8th bow is being finished as I post this, yes another rd). It is important to note that bows vary on how much rd they have. For example the bear Montana you mention is pretty slight, which in my mind gets rid of some of the negatives of a straight limbed longbow but maybe not enough to increase your speed to that of a recurve of equal draw weight.
Now your to your second question. The bear Montana is a lovely bow when set up well and will work fine for a hunter. A thing to consider will you be hunting out a tree stand? 64 inches is a long bow for a tree stand and you might find that length difficult. Despite my short stature of 5'6" my primary hunter is a 66 inch rd longbow and I have zero problems out of a tree stand. You will need to look up minimum draw weight limits if you havent already for your state. I have never owned a Montana but have shot them on a number of occasions and I am a fan of bears in general. There customer service is pretty good too. Now a new Montana runs about 399 but occasionally you can find one cheaper. But if you are thinking an rd longbow and have 400 bucks, I think you should give mike with Maddog archery a call. Most of the bows in his lineup are below that price range and it's a custom bow. I have a 56 inch prairie predator that is screaming fast and super smooth that I adore. He really makes a great bow and the great thing about a custom is just that. You can pick the woods and the glass color and all that jazz. Additionally, my kids have a couple of his kids bows which are also great. If you want to stick with production bows the Bodnik Slick Stick is the best 360 you will spend with a lifetime warranty.
Last note, I saw someone mention something about 3 under and using an elevated rest. This note is just to say that I dont know if you are 3 under or split. I am three under for life and order my bows tillered for 3 under (not aware of factory bows tiller for 3 under). I mention this because if you ever plan on going split finger in the future, I'd order a bow tillered for split which I have found can be tuned for 3 under easily. However, if you order a bow with a 3 under (even tiller) you will find that the bow will not shoot well split, so keep this in mind. Then again there are more than two options. Some people I think dan toelke for example shoots two under.
There are basic do's and dont's in the archery world but I find that archery is about what works. Different body types and arm lengths will find different forms more comfortable. I personally find it painful to shoot split and shoot quite well off the shelf with 3 under. If you do want to go with an elevated rest as previous suggested and are three under I would give a turkey feather rest a good look.
Hope this helps.
man thank you for that in depth insight. That is something to chew on for a bit
Hybrid longbow...
Two additional things to note. Terms like rd longbow and hybrid are from what I understand interchangeable. Also just personal preference here, but I like the way the shot feels and sounds better on a hybrid. Recurves tend to have more of a twang compared to a longbow thump. That said I do love my flatline widowmaker recurve.
I have noticed that longbows are much more quiet
Quote from: Vabowman on September 11, 2019, 07:53:59 PM
I have noticed that longbows are much more quiet
I would agree with this in general. Although one of the recurves I have is near silent. Kinda depends on how well you have them set up and tuned. I shoot home made wood arrows and I find that my bows are quieter in general from when I used to use carbons. Although I have no scientific way to prove this.
I have both but prefer the longbow. I like the low grip and the smooth draw. I have never owned the Montana but have shot it a number of times. I think it is a good bow, but I definitely prefer my bows from NM and HHA. However, the Montana is less expensive.
I love them both but I haven't shot a recurve in like 4 yrs I prefer my northern mist whisper
I love both. They have different qualities...but both can silently and accurately deliver a lethal arrow. Recurves are can be faster but are harder to get silent. Longbows are generally a bit slower (except hybrids)...maybe easier to tune and almost always silent with no or little effort.
If I had to pick just one style of bow to shoot for the rest of eternity ....it would however be a hybrid longbow. Seem to get the best of both...in one package.
You can see from the list below my name that I'm partial to Longbow, but most of mine have some R/D built into them.
-- Michael
I guess I am an odd ball as I prefer recurves over longbows. One thing is I like my bows very short with a shelf that is radiused closer to center. I have shot ASLs for a long time and I am that rare person who made the shift from Longbow to recurve. Usually the trend is the other way. The charm and simplicity of the longbow is not lost on me however. The paradox that associated with the Longbow is not to my liking.
One other thing ,I shoot three under and my bow is tillered for that. Also, I don't use an elevated rest or peep sight. Yes, I have owned and shot a compound for several years
years. Each to his own I guess.
See my signature below.
No question about it.Both
I like both!
Both, because I wake up in a different world every day.
Quote from: Gooserbat on September 12, 2019, 09:31:48 AM
Both, because I wake up in a different world every day.
Sounds like my ex gf. Matter of fact sounds like all my gfs
LMAO!!! and my ex wife as well.. :biglaugh:
A couple of years ago I got bit by the ASL bug and have been shooting one ever since. That said I still play with my recurves sometimes and also my DR longbow a friend made me. While I prefer (at this point) the ASL's, I still play with all my bows at least a little bit.
I have hunted for years with both, but currently its just longbow for me. I just find that I am more accurate and that the longbow is more forgiving of user errors. :knothead:
Recurves like the Toelke ss can be near darn silent. My ilf setup is louder than my recurve. It takes time to get in the groove with a recurve and if you find a bowyer like Dan who stands behind his product it is heaven. The feeling of a "let off" is a boon for me at least.
Yes , it is tougher to shoot well but once you are in form it is no less accurate than a r/d longbow.
I own both but have to say recurves are a better weapon for me.
well my only drawback for a LB is that Im super short..5'6 on a good day, most are way too long for I would think
You can get the hybrids pretty short. The one I just had built for example is only 52 inches long. I'm 56 also and have two bows that are 66inch that I use frequently and have no trouble with length.
even out of a treestand?
Not even out of a tree stand. With the 66 incher I currently use I just cant the bow as needed and shoot just fine.
Quote from: dahyer on September 11, 2019, 06:46:05 PM
Terms like rd longbow and hybrid are from what I understand interchangeable.
Yes and no.
The hybrid bow I make is an R/D. But I also make an R/D bow that I do not consider a hybrid. The difference to me is in how the string lays on the bow when strung. If the string contacts the limb after coming out of the string grooves(similar to a recurve) it is considered a hybrid. If the string makes no contact with the limb other than the string grooves, it is simply an R/D.
Clear as mud, right :biglaugh:
Most of the more "radical" R/D bows are fairly short, 54 -60". I shoot a 56" Kanati and it is smooth, very easy to shoot and has remarkable cast for a short bow.
Quote from: Bvas on September 12, 2019, 02:31:17 PM
Quote from: dahyer on September 11, 2019, 06:46:05 PM
Terms like rd longbow and hybrid are from what I understand interchangeable.
Yes and no.
The hybrid bow I make is an R/D. But I also make an R/D bow that I do not consider a hybrid. The difference to me is in how the string lays on the bow when strung. If the string contacts the limb after coming out of the string grooves(similar to a recurve) it is considered a hybrid. If the string makes no contact with the limb other than the string grooves, it is simply an R/D.
Clear as mud, right :biglaugh:
Ha. Thanks for the info
I shoot and enjoy both but the answer to your question is hybrid. As in a radical reflex deflex longbow. The sweetest bows I have shot have all been hybrid longbows, to me they are the best of both worlds.
I'm a longbow guy!!!!
Longbows go "thud", while recurved go "twang"!!
I just like the thud better!!!!! And besides, I don't have to keep up with a stringer for my longbow!!!!!
Seriously, it's all personal preference. You just have to shoot some of both, and see which one you like the best.
Bisch
I am loving my R/D longbow it's really smooth and accurate which everyone also comments how quite she is and really it's everything I need but I do have a longing for a 50@s style recurve with a slim grip to see what that's like,regards wayne
I have one custom R/D and the rest are all recurves. Been itching to try a longbow but haven't got around to it.
R/D seems to be the next 'thing' these days.
I was shooting recurves 30 years ago when my only hunting recurve delaminated on me in the middle of deer season. I sent the 'curve back for replacement and went looking for a temporary replacement to get me through deer season. Found a used Jerry Hill longbow for $125, bought it, and never went back to the recurve. When they returned my recurve with a new set of limbs, I traded it in on another longbow. Have probably owned 20 different long ows since; currently have only three. I just like them better, seems to suit my hunting and shooting style. I like the look, the utter simplicity, the forgiveness, and the tradition. Ive owned a couple more recurves since I went longbow, but found I didn't do well switching back and forth, so no more recurves for me. Just my preference, there are many, many recurve shooters who love them and are better shooters than I am. You just have to find your fit and go with it.
Quote from: Captain*Kirk on September 13, 2019, 08:49:31 PM
I have one custom R/D and the rest are all recurves. Been itching to try a longbow but haven't got around to it.
R/D seems to be the next 'thing' these days.
You need to get one.
Quote from: dahyer on September 14, 2019, 10:16:22 AM
You need to get one.
You aren't helping me manage my budget any, Dave... :readit:
Just so happens I was fawning all over a Bear Montana tonight, but...nevermind.
What you need is a 52 incher.
Gots me one o' dem...K-Mag. But it's a recurve. But you knew that.
Yes I did.
Landon, i see that you are not one of the tall guys, like me, just kidding, I don't want to know how short I am getting. I use to be almost 5' 10". I have about a 70" finger tip to finger tip wing span. Back in my younger taller target style years my draw was over 28", until I saw a picture of myself shooting. I looked like I was trying to fall over backwards. I was drawing 27" with a longbow when i went Hill style and was told that was too far. John was correct, 26&1/4" was way better. Left hand 26" is the correct full draw for me, so I shortened the right hand down to 26" so everything points or aims the same when i switch back and forth. with longbow form, you may find that you will get a better visual shooting split finger with a more relaxed and less jammed out reach. Height is not an accurate guide, measuring the wing span is a better one, even then there will be personal variations. The longest possible draw is quite often not the best possible draw.
pavan that's interesting...I have heard so much about extending draw length and the longer the better...I see what you mean, if you can't hit the side of the barn it makes no difference!
i remember from back in the 70s at Charlie Bledsoe's Sioux Falls archery shop, two guys going from bow to bow. The one guy was shorter than me. He pulled back a 30" draw bow, the other said, "Not that one, you are not quite stretched out yet." I could just about imagine how awkward he would look trying to shoot down out of a tree stand. 'stretched out' is not a longbow term.
A good longbow for you would be something like a 62" or 60" Robertson, depending on what your final longbow draw length would be. I would not be surprised if it settled into the 25" to 25.5" range, that is not a bad thing if it is what works the best for you.
yeh I would need the shortest bow possible! im 5'6 on a good day!
i rebuilt my target stack and worked on my house yesterday. Today I am less than 5'4", but the floor and my shoes are a very long ways down there. thank god for slip ons.
I'm 5'7" and my DL is right at 26&3/4". Short but I can handle just enough DW to feel like it doesn't handicap me too badly.
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With my Wing recurve and my Groves Spitfire my draw is 27". The difference is that with the pistol grip, the bow wrist and bow arm is straighter to gain a secure pivot on the grip without any squeeze. A straight grip bow likes to be heeled with a lower wrist, which naturally bends the bow arm. If you try to jam the bow arm straight with a low heeled straight grip ASL, that will pull the shoulder high and into a more vulnerable position. Shoulder position can have a a very real impact on draw length. jammed back and down or jammed up and back will shorten one's draw. i like the feeling of the shoulder being low and keeping the shoulder in line with the target with a bit of bent arm push in reserve.
Yep the higher wrist grip of a recurve is more difficult for me as well.
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I prefer a low grip of a longbow and the performance of a good RD longbow. :archer:
Piner, sounds like you need a saddle grip Robertson as well.
Like many I cut my teeth bowhunting with a recurve and shot them for decades sans a short compound stint in the early to mid 80's. I didn't try longbows until about 20 years ago. The quietness and simplicity is what grabbed me immediately. Bought a beautiful 62" Massie Longhorn, great shooter but could never get it quiet enough and sold it. I replaced it with an owl quiet 68" Hill cheetah. I shot that bow almost exclusively for about 8 years. Loved to shoot it but got tired of fighting the length in the tangled swamps and grunge I hunt in most often. Next I tried a 58" Great Norther critter gitter special and the Hill rarely came off the wall over the course of 4 years. Went on a recurve binge last year and got that out of my system. This year I wanted a t/d longbow and decided to try a 54" Toelke Pika and its now my go to rig for hunting. The Pika gives me all I need in a hunting bow, short, quiet, fast and very pack-able when I need to do that.
I started with recurves. After several years two HH longbows found their way in my arsenal. Spent weeks trying to shoot these bows. Never mastered them. Sold them and bought a recurve. With that said go with a recurve for the simple matter that recurves are generally easier to shoot. But...
Recurves do tend to be noisier but are faster overall than longbows.
Now I own 14 recurves (52" and up) and 1 68" longbow. One of my recurves is a 64" Bill Stewart Signature. Fast and quiet. The longbow (which I finally tamed) is my tied with the Bill Stewart for my favorite.
My comments are probably not much help and I rambled so just take it like it is.
Just spend some time with as many different types of bows as you can.
As a kid started with the longbow (Scouts) switched to a recurve for about thirty + years..now I'm a pretty solid fan / shooter of the longbow once again. I feel it's more of what I want in a hunting bow.
I started with recurves growing up til I got a compound for 3 years. Sold the compound in 1980 and went to a HH longbow. I've been shooting a longbow of one brand or another ever since. I do shoot a recurve for bowfishing but prefer the clean simple lines of the longbow for everything else. I do have about 12-15 recurves, bu also have 12 longbows.
For my entire life I thought I was a recurve man. Then I traded for a longbow and I learned I wasn't a recurve man. In other words try both, you might be surprised.
Quote from: Gooserbat on September 23, 2019, 12:11:16 AM
For my entire life I thought I was a recurve man. Then I traded for a longbow and I learned I wasn't a recurve man. In other words try both, you might be surprised.
Same thing happened to me.
More longbows than recurves, but My go to hunting bow is a recurve with a longbow grip (Widow PSR).