So the last three years I've been exclusively hunting state land after losing our favorite private spot. I've done lots of scouting and tried several spots. Finding game activity hasn't been tough. Getting away from the other hunters has been the challenge. I finally found a spot this year way back in the swamps. I was seeing lots of deer and waiting for the right opportunity. Then, like the turning of a faucet they were gone. Just disappeared. Been weeks since I've even seen a deer. So I decided to climb down and do some investigating. And sure enough I found a climber stand less than 100 yards from me. This is the most frustrating part of public land hunting. You can do everything right. But you just can't control the actions of others. I've seen guys smoking. Talking on their phones. You name it. And when that goes on 80 yards away it doesn't much matter how careful you are. Oye. The difficulty of public land hunting. Thinking my time might be better spent doing one nice out of state trip every year for hogs or something. Anyway that's my rant lol. Happy hunting all.
Certainly understand your frustration. I've dealt with it for many years and like you I'm constantly looking for places that are a challenge to get to. Understanding there are others like myself that will do anything to get away from others. Google earth, a canoe and a bicycle have been my help.
Quote from: Possum Head on November 10, 2018, 04:05:10 PM
Certainly understand your frustration. I've dealt with it for many years and like you I'm constantly looking for places that are a challenge to get to. Understanding there are others like myself that will do anything to get away from others. Google earth, a canoe and a bicycle have been my help.
Yeah..I hear that!
For the last twenty years I have, with my brothers tried to outwit the masses. We have been hunting primarily federal lands in Northern Michigan since forever but the last few years have turned me off to the point that I quit tryin...at least in that area.
Have since moved to South Carolina...startin over can be a good thing. There are hogs down here I'm told...hope to get out there for some of that action even tho my love is in the wiley whitetail hunt. :archer2:
I applaud you for trying to hunt on public land. I am a huge supporter of access to hunting that does not require one to be rich. That, to me, is the American heritage of hunting. I did move back west because of this and now I am limited to a little over 34 million acres of land I co-own in Idaho to hunt. I do have to drive a way's to get there, 1.6 miles. Sometimes I just walk there. Access to public land like this is a real privilege and took a lot of work by outdoorsmen before me. Be active in your state to support expansion of this resource, you will benefit, your children even more. Also, when I was in MN I did reach out to those hunting near me, they were in the same shoes as me, and most were very good about trying to avoid getting in each others way.
Good advice guys. Biggest problem is that I live I the most heavily populated area of Michigan. And most of the guys I actually meet out there are nice guys. As stated they're in the same boat as me. Without private access it's public land. And for those of us in our area there's a lot available but it's very hard hit because it's the closest to home. For the weekend hunts after a 60 hour work week it's just what's available. And that's the scenario for many of us. Thinking maybe next year I focus on quality not quantity. Instead of getting out every weekend near home, maybe I drive five hours north where it's less crowded and hit it hard for a week. I don't need to "get a deer" every year. But seeing em sure does make the trip a little nicer lol.
Idk every time I hear this I wonder, round here the private land is actually more crowded. On state land it's easy to climb higher, cross a river/reservoir, etc. try some distancing techniques to help you. Another thing I do which works real well, lots of guys are afraid of something. Say it's bears, if someone happens to catch you in or going in area and asks what you've seen, you say nothing but these damn bears. In my state hunting them is very limited but people are chicken turds. You can substitute bears for lions, boars, wolves. It won't discourage everyone but it might that guy that caught you.
Another thing I do is use almost no bright eyes using power line stantions, counting ridges, and going in the dark. If you use a bright eye mark right to go left. Park on the wrong side of the road, walk down the road. You can guarantee wherever you are some idiot will sit next to you if he can. Who knows how "clean" he hunts.
Use your brain and use as many obstacles/tricks as you can. I'll bet state land gets better. Another thing, bounce around. You mention a climber near "your spot"? That all you got? Diversify, rest areas, hunt the wind and food sources. I should add food sources change throughout a season. You need to move. One spot will never stay great forever
I grew up battling the guys on public land in Northern Michigan. It's tough. Not only is everyone trying to hunt the same spots, but a lot of these guys believe that they own the land and the deer on it. It always astounds me how worked up some people will get over a deer. I've had guys sit in their trucks and honk when they know I'm hunting, I've had them walk up and start yelling from the opposite ridge if I've seen anything, had someone let their dog lose on my track and then come running up saying that the dog jumped out the window, etc. I even had a guy bring his truck and plow a huge pile of snow up in the middle of the road so that I couldn't get through during late bow season.
Like Bowguy said, learn to outsmart them. I've used his bear trick before, mostly on second or third cousins, and it works pretty well. I would like to walk in in the dark, but I'd rather not get shot so I always carry a light.
Sometimes the best spots are the ones that seem like they wouldn't be any good at all. You just need to figure out where everyone else is hunting and try to avoid them. Also, when you are able to figure out where someone is hunting, figure out where you can hunt nearby so that if he's in the stand, he may spook deer towards you.
It's tough and frustrating at times, but it can be really rewarding when it works out.
I'm always just stunned at how quick it can change. I had deer almost round the clock for a couple weeks. Then bang nothing. Ah well. The only real opportunity I had was a shot I wasn't comfortable with on a big doe. And if that turns out to be the only chance I get I have no regrets. Passing was the right call. Honestly though I did think it was a matter of time before a better opportunity presented itself. Looking like that may be wishful thinking lol.
Well here they run dogs for deer? I have only ever hunted public land so used to it? I learned to use everything to my advantage or just not worry about it. I have had packs of hounds chasing one deer by stand and en five minutes later a deer walks out feeding on acorns! Not worried a bit.
I don't get to kill a lot but a couple though with hurricane this season is a toss up?
One friend that does kill a lot of deer smokes on stand like a smoke stack? He ends up filling all his tags with a bow. Almost makes me wanna take up smoking? One place we used to hunt we would hunt close enough I could see him down through the swamp, I could see the puffs of smoke coming off the tree? His theory is if they can smell that cig they can smell you without the cig.
Point is to just hunt on and keep maneuvering, keep pushing - deer are there and your gonna get them.
J
Also keep in mind this time of year there are a lot of guys in the woods getting ready for rifle season. That tends to affect movement as well. Around where I hunt during the week preceding the opener, bait piles start popping up everywhere and the deer start to go nocturnal.
Lots of good comments. We do belong to clubs and regularly get invited to great private places each year yet we hunt public land about half the time every year. The reason is the hunting on public land is excellent during bow season. Talking NC, SC, GA. What we do is walk one mile from the gate - this is a 15 minute walk at a quick pace. We always do this and it is not easy but you must do it. Cancel these areas close to the gate. There are food plots and huge acorn trees and scrapes in the roads and we ignore these and get in one mile - then begin scouting.
We use water entry as mentioned - this IS a method unto itself and our preferred method.
A bicycle is also very productive when you can use one but truth is most of our stuff is way too rough for bikes.
Doing this we have hunted public land here in the south since the late 80s and never seen another hunter in the woods during bow season!!! Never.
We think a big part of the reason for our success is that 'baiting' is not legal on public land in these 3 states and it is the predominant method used on private land in these states.
As long is it keeps on working we will keep doing it.
Quality over quantity - agree - and I would not waste my time hunting anywhere near a road or easy access.
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He we have lots of public land where a guy can get a mile in here in Michigan. In fact I hunted one pc of public land a couple years ago that I abandoned. It looked amazing but man opening day is was literally crawling with hunters. Anyway I ran into a great guy loading out a pack in the parking lot and got to talking. He said he was going in for three days. And had an hour hike through very rough terrain ahead of him. That he'd been Hunting here his whole life and had killed some giant bucks. I think I've gotta change up my methods. I got used to private farmland hunting. Deer were pretty predictable there and we had it to ourselves. Gonna have to up my game.
It doesn't just happen on public land my friend. our private land borders a large wooded plot owned by a neighbor who leases it for hunting. It never fails the guys leasing will nuzzle up to our property line with their stands, even yelling and complaining to me when I was in our own timber cutting firewood. :coffee:
Lungbuster if I may as I don't wanna offend you but are you sure you're traveling as far as you think??? Crawling w hunters opening day sounds maybe you're closer than you think possibly.
Download a foot pedometer. Years ago a buddy of mine was complaining he was in "so far". I think it was like 1/4 mile. The point is there's lots of variables at work here. Say every single person went in a mile, shoot than the low hanging fruit near the road lies unpicked and undisturbed.
I kinda doubt that's true so wherever the guys are use them as part of your plan.
When I was younger the state wma near me stocked pheasants. Every Tom, Dick n Harry went out for the Chinese chickens.
So you actually couldn't hunt there. On top at another section of the wma was another road above the guys a ways. About the time I started hearing shooting here come the deer like clockwork.
Ok so you have no other access. Walk/circle around. Another state forest I used to hunt black powder. The quickest way to get to a decent spot was through the safety zone by the state cabins. You couldn't hunt it but could walk through. Most guys are lazy and sleep way too late. Right at daylight they'd come through the safety zone, pushing all the deer I skirted a ways around right to me. All they heard was a shot. The deer came out ran a ridge and went back in. Next group of guys came in the same thing happened. At times I'd kill a deer, a friend would hop in my spot and kill one 1/2 hr later.
In the valley by my house the idiots love driving. I go up above em on the mountain 4 ridges or so up, it's actually maybe only 400-500 yards above em. The deer come through steadily and calmly.
I could go on but hopefully you see it's easy to make excuse they screwed up your deer. Just find out where they are pushing them to.
This is another technique.
Now here's the thing. I personally say today's hunters don't really hunt. Hear me out. Ever hear a trapper say it's too hard or an animal is too hard? They figure a way to trick the animal using sometimes really ingenious ways.
Today's hunter watched some bs on tv. They throw corn down, use ozonics and sit in one tree. That's not really hunting. None of it it. Hunting is a a verb. It's proactive.
Personally find not one spot but lots of spots. Plan your season according to patterns of food sources changing, Hunter pressure, deer behavior shifts and very important wind. Rest your spots. Stop complaining things shut off. Don't give up, figure where they turned on.
I hope you're thinkimg about what I'm saying and not thinking anything is a bash on anyone or thing.
Maybe you've heard 10% of the hunters kill 90% of the game. It's not because these guys have perfect spots. They have the persistence and imagination to get the most out of what they have. Doesn't mean they settle either. Keep looking keep thinking.
I agree getting far back in is often a great strategy. But it all depends on the property that you're hunting. I hunted a piece in New York, it was the closest public land within a 30-minute radius. It was only four hundred and twenty Acres with a road going through the middle. I spent the first year going to the farthest end of the property where there was decent sign. I saw deer while scouting but never while Hunting. I spent time in there after the season was over, and did some squirrel hunting. What I learned is the majority of the deer we're traveling close to the road and to the parking lot. I went in the following year and was a bit shocked when in and there were 11 Vehicles parked and 15 people signed in that morning so far. I proceeded to my spot that was a 4 minute walk from the parking lot, it was very thick but I could make out vehicles in the parking area through the trees. I never saw another hunter in the woods, I saw three deer that morning, and I had one on my head had to be processed by 8 a.m.
To add to what Bow guy said, if you can pattern the hunters you're in a much better position. Another piece of public land I hunted in New York, preseason scouting was somewhat of a waste of time. I found my best places in this area during the season. A lot of hunters in this area were slobs and not only left the garbage but cat eyes and tree stands in the trees. Some of my best places I found by not finding any hunter trash that was fresh. This particular property was made up of a bunch of smaller parcels. So it was impossible to get in too deep. But I could find thick drainages that were hard to access. Often the most productive times of day or between 10 a.m. and 2 p.m. .
Deer can pattern a hunter much quicker than a hunter in pattern a deer. And the hunter is still in the woods long after he is left for the day. He leaves a scent behind and any deer traveling through that spot nocturnally knows that the hunter was there, and they will adjust their patterns accordingly
All state land in Iowa needs to be 'leave no trace'. Meaning you leave with what you came in with.
I understand what the Michigan guys are saying, it's tough. I hunted and still do hunt state and federal land that I've hunted for 45 years. It's different now. Everyone has a GPS so they venture in farther. They seem to all have AWD or 4 WD vehicles. They also seem to have more time off than I ever did at their ages. We still kill deer out there but it's different. You can't pick up a track and hope to head the buck off. You'll just push him to someone. I heard this is the last year for baiting. That might help. I mostly just hunt my 40 now until late season. This land I'm speaking of us in counties that don't have the APR line the west side of the state. It's flooded with people who just want to take something home. Good Luck Guys.
I hear you. I hunt almost exclusively on public land in West Michigan, as well. I've learned to hunt on Sunday mornings because people are at church. Or weekdays because people are at work. It gets rough the week before gun season. People will start hanging stands and setting up blinds.
My suggestion is to get in early and stay as long as you can. As previously stated, distancing techniques also help. The harder the hike, the thicker the brush, the less hunters there are. Most guys hang out within 100 yards of their vehicle.
Ultimately, weekdays are where it is at. Get that time off.
Never fall in love with a spot on public land.
Every trip is a scouting trip on public land.
Nobody on this planet wants to be retired more than I do. Then I can get out during the week. I'm ready, my bird dogs want me to retire as well.
I hunt public land in Iowa and I mix it up a lot. If I find other hunters are walking in deep I will hunt closer to where I am parking. Some of my best hunts have been within 150 yards of my vehicle. When going in deep I make sure I am the first one in the parking lot.
Funny you mention that stikbowshooter, I killed a doe no more than 25 yards from the road doing that.
The tricky part of Michigan is that most properties are bordered by private land/homes. One man's "deep" is another man's "shallow" LOL
I haven't read all of the responses in detail so if this has been said I apologize. But you say you hunted the same spot repeatedly for a couple of weeks? To me, that is your problem. No way can the wind be good for the same spot time after time. Not only does the wind need to be favorable for where you expect deer to come from, but it must be perfect so they can't smell you coming and going. Even if you think the deer haven't busted you, you can bet they are aware of your coming and goings. They smell you as you enter and leave and they smell everywhere you have walked after you leave. Your scent lingers long after you are gone on your repeated entry and exit routes and it doesn't take them long to realize that "your spot" is too be avoided.
The other hunter and his climber didn't help, but my guess is you are your own worst enemy.
Quote from: John Scifres on November 12, 2018, 11:58:37 AM
Never fall in love with a spot on public land.
Every trip is a scouting trip on public land.
Love that!
Quote from: Whip on November 13, 2018, 03:44:16 PM
But you say you hunted the same spot repeatedly for a couple of weeks? To me, that is your problem. No way can the wind be good for the same spot time after time. Not only does the wind need to be favorable for where you expect deer to come from, but it must be perfect so they can't smell you coming and going. Even if you think the deer haven't busted you, you can bet they are aware of your coming and goings. They smell you as you enter and leave and they smell everywhere you have walked after you leave. Your scent lingers long after you are gone on your repeated entry and exit routes and it doesn't take them long to realize that "your spot" is too be avoided.
The other hunter and his climber didn't help, but my guess is you are your own worst enemy.
I would have to agree there. I've heard at least 2 maybe even 3 weeks between spots. And if you are on the ground...probably better off hunting different locations throughout the year. I know for a fact I've screwed up a lot of locations for myself in the past not following this formula. I won't be touching any spot I've already hunted for the remainder of the year.
I won't hunt the same spot more than twice in a row on the public land I hunt. I figure if you give them a morning and evening commute to see or smell your presence, they are taking an alternate route on their next trip to work or home. And no permanent stands.
That might change a bit in the rut but everything changes in the rut. Park your butt in a saddle with lunch and a pee bottle and a favorable wind and wait.
Public land deer are smart and wise to the ways of the two-legs. But you can use that to your advantage.
Lots of guys are recommending resting spots. I also do so and it doesn't matter private or state land. It should be known you need to hunt the wind and it's important your scent doesn't blow into them on entrance, exit or after they pass you.
You can't use the same way in and out almost ever because of the wind direction.
Not only will today be screwed up if you don't avoid their sense of smell but you make em suspicious for weeks if not the season.
That being said, let's look imagine a clock. If the deer are going into a cut cornfield moving from 12 to 6. Say it's a hill but your truck is beyond the corn. Most guys hunt than get down and blow deer out. Keep doing that and your odds lower. I'd like to see a 2-8 wind direction. That'd keep the scent blowing away from the deer, and I'd be on the downwind side. Upon getting down I'd walk across a ridge and skirt way around em. Are some deer blown up? Prob. But the deer you're hunting are less disturbed.
If you analyze things you'll see a need for a whole buncha stands depending on wind or just one climber you can move each time to up your odds.
State land hunters need to keep adjusting and thinking imo.
Need to add not all spots are huntable on all days. That's a hard pill to swallow for some guys but it's important too
One helpful idea may be to get as far back in as possible, and find the really thick stuff. I have observed that even most bowhunters like a relatively open spot and deer often prefer the heavy bushes when hunters are around.
Been there done that brother..lol. I've had some private land available to me for the past 3 years but prior to that it was always public land. I've always considered myself lucky to have a 17,000 acre state park just over an hour from my house. I remember back around 2006 and through maybe 2013 the place had plenty of deer. I always saw some..maybe not every single outing but certainly for a few outings each season. Then it just all went away. Dealing with other hunters was always a challenge and I would go at least 3/4 mile into the woods and many times a good deal further than that.
I remember one hunting a scrape line and finding someone else' scent wicks hanging there along the same line about 50 yds from where I was sitting.
That's just the way it is on public land. Now the place seems to be shot out. I mean until last week I had not seen so much as a track in 3 seasons.
Still, I'll always be grateful for having that place to hunt so close to home. A property that large allows you to really cover ground and feel like you have hunted
I've found public land hunting here to be interesting. I don't see any deer but the old busted-up couches, abandoned cars and stacks of torn-up trash bags make it all worthwhile. The state does it's part as well, limiting tree stands to two and requiring that hunters provide them the GPS lat/long locations of each stand in order to get the state permission permit needed to use tree stands on public land. Oh, and lest we forget the 4X4s parked and blocking road access, walkie-talkie deer drivers, and the ubiquitous squadron of ATVs that show up and linger after you've just spent 2 hours hiking in.
Ayah, public land hunting...the practical alternative to completely wasting your time.
One thing I've found is no matter how far you hike from the gate/parking spot, eventually your a mile closer to the next gate.
That's so true soonerlongbow. I like how some of the guys drive around and try to figure out where you walk in at and are going to . That's why I don't use bright eyes anymore.
Quote from: TwistedHollow on November 28, 2018, 08:54:32 PM
That's so true soonerlongbow. I like how some of the guys drive around and try to figure out where you walk in at and are going to . That's why I don't use bright eyes anymore.
I think they come in handy on state land. Just have them going the opposite direction of where you're going. I used to use little bits of orange ribbon at a spot that was super tough to navigate in the dark. Then I found out my cousin was following my ribbon path so took them all down and tied them in a big circle. I don't know how many times he went around, but I haven't seen him back there again!
Yes public land hunting can be difficult, that is all I hunt. But, at the same time, I am great full we live in a country that still has land for access to harvest game. One of the things that I do is, learn how the other hunters change the animal behavior and use that to my advantage. This was a huge cause for me to start hunting on the ground, so I am more flexible.
I have not enjoyed hunting the local state management areas but I love the National Forest further down state. I think some of the state forest would be ok too.
One of the things that I really dislike about the WMA is that you can't really go "further back". They have access trails like every ten feet. It's crazy...nothing but tree stands everywhere you go. I'd rather hunt those places on the ground and moving around a bit but I'me afraid of bumping into occupied tree stands and ruining somebody else's hunt.
I guess if all I had to hunt were the state WMA I'd just stop hunting. Even the squirrel hunting is lousy on these places.
For the most part I've never had access to deer hunting on private land.