Alright guys, doing one for myself here and thought I'd make a build along for it in an attempt to help folks the same way I was helped! Just got the last of the wood I needed from Kenny today, so time to get working!
It's going to be a 64" ntn longbow, powerlam, tip wedges, wood stack is .348 @.006, powerlam and lam closest to back is a-boo, lam closest to belly is maple. .040 glass. The veneers are going to be mahogany and the riser is macassar. Also going to be using antler for the tips and hopefully the riser highlight, excited for that.
Started riser work today, will get the build along going later today!
We all like build alongs so post away as you go.
:campfire: :coffee:
Here we go! So I had an issue with this riser piece, which is that I did the cut across the back about a month ago to speed the drying time. At the time, I thought I could get by with my riser design with no I beam, which I later found to not be the case.
So, I bought some g10 this time around to dodge the issues with linen phenolic and I got it 1/8" thick. I decided to do a center beam of riser wood instead of my normal 1/4" pheno straight through the middle.
Here's after cutting the center beam, so the riser is in 3 pieces, two 1/2" pieces and one 1/4" piece:
(http://s27.postimg.org/c297nbxxf/bowbuild_001.jpg)
Then I had to cut the g10 to match. This all would have been a whole lot easier if I hadn't done that riser cut across the back. Also, g10 is some serious stuff, gruesome on my bandsaw. Definitely need ear protection.
(http://s27.postimg.org/o2q2abfyb/bowbuild_004.jpg)
Next I ground down the lams to splice them. I just clamp a piece of plywood to my edge sander.
(http://s27.postimg.org/qvj9ucgar/bowbuild_006.jpg)
And then glue them together, using a straightedge to make sure they are dead straight. I use the gorilla ca glue with rubber for this.
(http://s27.postimg.org/hz8hqepoj/bowbuild_008.jpg)
Next, I cut the mahogany veneers. Didn't get a shot of how I do this, but I just use a thin metal yardstick, clamp it at each end after marking 1.5", and run a razorblade down the edge. I do two at once and it came out well. Here's the mahogany I'm using:
(http://s27.postimg.org/9m7e9hfur/bowbuild_007.jpg)
The last thing I got done today was gluing up the riser pieces from the first shots. Didn't get a pic of this either, but you'll see them tomorrow when I flush everything up. Was quite a nightmare with the epoxy and all the pieces shifting about, but think it'll work just fine.
Tomorrow I'll join one set of the veneers, shape the riser to the form, cut out the belly side of the riser, do the fades, and prepare for glue up on friday!
:campfire:
:coffee:
looking good. what is G10?
G10 is a plastic made from fiberglass and epoxy. Normal phenolic is made with linen, cloth or paper and epoxy. This stuff is much more heavy duty. Not so nice to work with though haha. Should make the riser relatively indestructible though.
thanks, as I've never experienced it over here.
Looking great!
Thanks for sharing.
Martin from Sweden
I used to work in a machine shop where we would sometimes have to machine parts from G10 and G11. It has good electrical insulating and heat resistant properties. Keeping it wet while working with it helps with the dust and therefore the itching. Using a vacuum to vacuum up the dust helps too. I can pretty much look at the stuff and start itching.
Lookin good
Hahah, for some reason fiberglass doesn't seem to bother me much. I don't have dust collection, and wear my normal clothes when I work, but never seem to be itchy.
Also, here's the main riser piece after sanding the glue off and truing everything up. Came out nice considering how tricky the glue job was! I'm more worried about the other pieces (I use the leftovers from the cut across the back as the handle and sight window pieces on the belly of the riser), but I think they'll be fine too, still waiting for them to dry as I don't need to work on them today and didn't have them under a spotlight all night. Will post a picture of those soon so you know what I'm talking about.
(http://s30.postimg.org/otomhcl29/bowbuild_009.jpg)
Liking it!
Next was sanding the belly side flat and flush.
(http://s30.postimg.org/m6g7rdj8h/bowbuild_021.jpg)
Then fitting the back to the form. Nowadays this just takes a few minutes, used to take for ever haha. I use my edge sander for both of these tasks.
(http://s30.postimg.org/jewy0rkpt/bowbuild_020.jpg)
After that I draw the line for the cut across the belly. I draw the fades, then mark 1.25" from the back and basically connect the dots. I tried to take a picture of the pencil line but it didn't show up too well.
(http://s30.postimg.org/ilkc85eox/bowbuild_023.jpg)
Here's a picture after doing the cut on the bandsaw. Was really rough, two layers of g10 and the ebony. Just went reeeeaallly slow.
(http://s30.postimg.org/terugnvz5/bowbuild_024.jpg)
These are the extra pieces from the cut across the back. I also had to glue the g10 i beams in these, don't know how much luck I'll have getting all the layers to line up.
(http://s30.postimg.org/o2302j82p/bowbuild_025.jpg)
So the original riser is now in 4 pieces, here's a pic of how they all fit together. I only use one 1.5x2x22" block for my risers. You can also see why this would have been about 1000x easier if I hadn't done that first cut.
(http://s30.postimg.org/pg8f32bhd/bowbuild_027.jpg)
Alright, so after getting it fit to the form and cleaning up the other pieces, I worked the fades and smoothed out the angles and everything from the belly cut I had just done. Again on the edge sander. I put the other 3 riser pieces to the side now, as I won't be touching them again until after glue up.
(http://s30.postimg.org/j19e6e4rl/bowbuild_028.jpg)
Sanded the ends and glued together one set of the mahogany veneers. I only have to do the belly side veneers as I'll be cutting through all the layers on the back later.
(http://s30.postimg.org/vxrdg2ae9/bowbuild_029.jpg)
All that's left is to sand the lam joints, mark center on my p-lam, and start the glue up! I'll sand the lams and make sure everything fits nicely today, then heat the shop up tomorrow and do the glue up. Here's the riser ready for some lams to dress it up a bit!
(http://s30.postimg.org/jgknzeqox/bowbuild_030.jpg)
That's all for today!!
Looking good :thumbsup:
X 2!
Lookin good Nick!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
I urge you to get some dust collection tho ,man!!
Looking good! Tomorrow can't get here soon enough!!
Thanks guys! And I know it Kenny!! A dust collection system is number 3 on my list, a new hotbox and a dehumidifier being 1 and 2 haha.
Alright, did glue up today. Not much to say here that hasn't been said before. I use paste wax on the form to keep from anything sticking. Then I lay down saran wrap and go about it like normal. Here's everything layed out in order and ready for epoxy. I use 4.5-5 spoonfulls of each part of the epoxy. I usually slightly favor the hardener.
(http://s4.postimg.org/4ihu45myl/bowbuild_031.jpg)
And here's a shot after laying everything down and taping it in place. I have center marked on all of my lams to make lining everything up and making sure it stays there easier.
(http://s4.postimg.org/mwsd84z99/bowbuild_033.jpg)
All that was left was to put the aluminum strip down, the hose, then clamp the top in place. Pumped it up to 65 psi, making sure to give time between every 10 psi to let the epoxy move around without pulling my veneers apart. Everything looked good and lined up nicely, so I stuck it in the oven!
That's all for today! Tomorrow will be cleaning it up, seeing how the joints came out, then marking out, cutting, and sanding the limbs to shape, and finally, get the belly riser overlays shaped and glued on! Big day!
That's going to be a cool looking bow- I like the profile in the form.
Waiting to see some more!
I'm drooling again! Looking good there bud.
Looks very good, Nick! Need more!
Alright! Done for the day! This is gonna be a long one. Here we go...
So, I woke up to a freshly cooked bow...
(http://s28.postimg.org/jx8onlc19/bowbuild_034.jpg)
I pulled it out of the form and started sanding it down. Got it down so all the lams were lined up on both sides. The fades came out great! Stoked about that, was a bit nervous with the two .150 lams. Lotta wood haha.
(http://s28.postimg.org/sqzl4oyzx/bowbuild_035.jpg)
And a shot of the back veneers before I cover um up with tape.
(http://s28.postimg.org/68o387qr1/bowbuild_039.jpg)
Next I put tape across the back and set up the laser level. My level automatically adjusts to true level, so I just clamp my by to the table and shim it till it checks out with a level over the entire length. It's important to make sure it's level through the whole thing, otherwise your line won't come out truly straight.
(http://s28.postimg.org/ata9n5agd/bowbuild_040.jpg)
I just draw my limb straight onto the tape with no template. Also, I freehand the centerline. Tried clamping a straight edge, but it never stayed straight and was a pain with the laser, was hard freehanding the first couple times, now it's quick and easy. I start my taper at the end of my powerlam, which is 30" long. I mark a line at 15" from center on both limbs. This is to be a 64" bow ntn, so I measure out to 32" on both limbs and mark again. Here I've also drawn the finished lines for the middle section. I do this by using a ruler, lining a mark up with the centerline, then measuring out on each side. This bow is 1 3/8 thick to powerlam end. Then I clamp the straightedge and draw the line.
(http://s28.postimg.org/5tctf74tp/bowbuild_042.jpg)
Next I mark 3/8" at the nocks to be. I then clamp the straightedge and connect the dots. Make sure the straight edge is absolutely flat to the limb or your line will come out wonky!
(http://s28.postimg.org/86zcjy8ml/bowbuild_047.jpg)
And after doing that for all the parts, we have our limb template drawn on..
(http://s28.postimg.org/a8v8kgh7x/bowbuild_046.jpg)
And cut out on the bandsaw..
(http://s28.postimg.org/49c2ujlt9/bowbuild_050.jpg)
Then sanded them to the line.
So unfortunately the glue up didn't go perfectly. My belly veneer ripped when I was pulling the veneer off of my table. I stuck it together on the limb as I had no real choice, and it has worked in the past. Unfortunately the rip was up in the reflex part of the limb and separated because of the angle. While this is purely cosmetic and the gap is completely filled with epoxy, it is a bummer none the less.
(http://s28.postimg.org/u7fp0kral/bowbuild_052.jpg)
Anyways, moving on, I sanded the belly side of the riser and fit our leftover piece from earlier to the belly. This is the first part of the belly overlays. This is a tricky fit to do, not nearly as fast and easy as getting the back to fit the form.
(http://s28.postimg.org/fe11ftjjh/bowbuild_055.jpg)
After getting it all shaped, I cut out pieces of glass and a stip of maple to use as highlights and for strength. I also cut the final riser pieces to rough shape and the correct length. Also notice how I leave the top of them flat, that is so I can clamp it easier. I just butt joint them as separate pieces, then sand all the way through the joint later. Don't forget to sand the finished sides of the glass or the epoxy won't stick very well! Here's a picture with everything ready for epoxy.
(http://s28.postimg.org/40ei4m90t/bowbuild_058.jpg)
Finally, I mix up 2 spoonfulls of each part of epoxy, and glue everything up. Had a bit too much glue left over, will use slightly less next time. This is a tricky glue up, everything wants to move around. I've found it helps to use small shims to keep the riser from rocking, but not so long as to keep you from being able to use the spring clamps. After this, I set a heat light up close and rotate it periodically.
(http://s28.postimg.org/iao2g3pd9/bowbuild_060.jpg)
And that's all for today! Tomorrow is a pretty short day, as most of it will be spent waiting for epoxy to dry. Tip overlays, the cut into the back, and back overlays tomorrow!
Thanks for the build along! Always fun to watch others work and pictures say so much more than words. Bummer about the veneer. I had one that had a small crack I had noticed before glue up. I went ahead thinking the crack would disappear but I guess the pressure of the hose actually made it a lot worse. It filled with epoxy and shoots fine but it kinda looks like a worm tunnel in the wood.
I agree, the only reason I can build bows at all is because a bunch of other people did this same thing haha. And yeah, it's a bummer. I need to figure out a way to keep my lams from sticking to the table after coating one side of it with epoxy. Maybe wax paper? Oh well, now I have an authentic excuse for this to be my bow hahah.
Bummer on the veneer crack but I'm enjoying the build along!
QuoteOriginally posted by bornofmud:
I agree, the only reason I can build bows at all is because a bunch of other people did this same thing haha. And yeah, it's a bummer. I need to figure out a way to keep my lams from sticking to the table after coating one side of it with epoxy. Maybe wax paper? Oh well, now I have an authentic excuse for this to be my bow hahah.
Bad deal on the veneer bud!
Not sure I understand on sticking to the table.
I never put the glued side to table. I build the stack and keep putting glued sides on the stack.
I may misunderstand how you did it tho. :)
Do you only coat one side Kenny? I always have coated both sides, but if that is unnecessary, I'd save a lot of glue and frustration haha. Or do you coat one side, put it on the form, then coat the other side? Seems like stuff would move around a lot doing it that way.
I do it by coating one side, flipping it over (so now the side I just put glue on is on the table)then coating the other side, then put it on the form, then repeat, so that all surfaces have epoxy on um.
Nick you'll have better luck especially with veneers if you put glue on your glass then one side of the veneer and put those two sides together and then do the other side of the veneer. I do the rest of the lams this way and add them to the stack- then move whole stack to the form.
I coat one side on bench over paper, then move each lam to the form and then coat second side. Make sure all are lined up and true and use a temporary cable tie in four places to hold until airhose is inflated to about 15 - 20#. The cable ties can then be withdrawn and hose inflated in stages.
Glue on all surfaces(cept the outside of glass)
I do it like David,
Glue on glass and one side of lam, then flip lam over on glass and do other side.
On TDs you can do the whole limb on the bench, but on my D/Rs with the riser in the mix, I do all the full length lams for bow back, then lay that on form. Then do a short stack for both ends on the belly and making sure which end is to center, lay it on the riser and proceed as usual.
I always lay all the parts out and mark on tape, CENTER on the short stacks!! I would hate to tiller one with a taper turned the wrong way on one end!! :scared:
Ahhh, I get it, that is a much better way to do that and would definitely make it easier to keep the delicate pieces together. Thanks Kenny! Will be doing that next time.
Almost done for today, will have some pics up shortly!
In fact, on thin veneers, I flip the glass over on top of veneer and that way don't have to pick the glued veneer up at all.
I also glue 2 at a time side by side when the thickness is similar. Like .040 glass and .030 to .050 lam....
Thanks for the tips guys! I'm sure it'll help others out there like me that missed that one. Or maybe it's obvious for everyone else and I'm just a bit slow haha!
On with the build!
So after gluing on the belly overlays, I sanded everything flush on one side.
(http://s3.postimg.org/scf20gls3/bowbuild_061.jpg)
I then used this side on my edge sander to keep everything square for the cut into the back. I measured out 4" from center in each direction, made a mark, and used the rubber rolling pin on my edge sander to sand down to the riser wood, from there I just followed the arc of the riser and sanded off all the layers of lams. Here's what I got:
(http://s3.postimg.org/k8bj9goqr/bowbuild_064.jpg)
I wanted to do an antler overlay on top of clear glass for this bow. So I cut out the straightest and widest part of the antler I could, filled it with thin CA glue, then sanded it to fit the arch of the back.
(http://s3.postimg.org/6m6836hqb/bowbuild_065.jpg)
I used two pieces of .030 ULS glass for the glass overlay. In order to get the glass to fit the curve, I had to taper the ends. I did this by taking a spare piece of wood, and pushing against the sander and the piece of glass, doing half of the glass at a time. I bent the glass so that my hand wasn't right next to the running sander.
(http://s3.postimg.org/ujnw24gg3/bowbuild_069.jpg)
Finally, I traced the arch of the cut onto little chunks of wood and made some clamping cauls. Mixed up some epoxy and glued everything up.
(http://s3.postimg.org/yc2t446kj/bowbuild_072.jpg)
I made some antler tips earlier and used them for the tip overlays, along with some black glass. I still haven't decided if I'm going to leave them full like they are now or sand them down. I kind of like them like this, but it makes stringing it a bit more difficult and increases the chance of them breaking off from an impact or something.
(http://s3.postimg.org/3td0j5hdv/bowbuild_071.jpg)
And after drying! I did the same thing to dry these, took a little heat lamp and rotated it around for about 8 hours, then let it dry over night.
(http://s3.postimg.org/cah47tbgj/bowbuild_078.jpg)
After that, I cut out the sight window on my bandsaw. I start the cut 4" above center, and cut to 1" above center. I cut to the center of the bow, and usually after shaping everything, am about 1/16" past center. After cutting the window, the fun begins! Here's a picture after sanding for a bit.
(http://s3.postimg.org/cw633x6ir/bowbuild_079.jpg)
And the tips after a bit of shaping but with no nocks yet.
(http://s3.postimg.org/6jqxu33gj/bowbuild_081.jpg)
Next I cut the arrow shelf. I just do two cuts with a handsaw so that it makes a point, then will later go back over it with a dremel to make it nice. I also go over the corner with a round file and round it out. Here's a shot after doing the rough cuts.
(http://s3.postimg.org/g5kiadumb/bowbuild_082.jpg)
Next, I cut the nocks. I do this the same way as most. I mark where they need to be, mark a line with the 45* on my combination square, go over it with a triangle file, then carve the nocks with a round file. Here's a shot at too high of a brace height
(http://s3.postimg.org/70c5gir7n/bowbuild_086.jpg)
And a full draw shot! I'll get a proper braced shot when I fix the brace height. I'm about 1" shy of my full draw, probably pulling to 28" with too high of a brace here (figure that close to balances out haha). This thing is heeeeaavy. I was aiming for 55#, feels more like 65+#. I think I over compensated my stack thickness for the extra length I added. That's ok, I'm young, I'll build up to it haha. Just going to be tinkering and refining from here. Will add more as it continues!
(http://s12.postimg.org/mw9t8m8wd/bowdraww.jpg)
Also, have about 3/16" negative tiller right now, will weaken the top limb till I get 1/8" - 3/16" positive. Have a couple more overlays to do as well. Trying to decide if I'm going to have any antler in them or just macassar and black glass.
Hell those antler tips look sharp!
Generally I just can repeat I like this bow/design you developed!
Something out of the row always meets my demand to like the bow and this is kind of unique for sure...
Looking Good. Bue--.
That's cool. I definitely give you an "A" for originality with that riser and those tips.
It's bending nice!
Nice to see some elb make it into your bow very nice. Gotta luv that arc. And the riser is looking very stealthy. Great lines my eyes don't stop in any one place. Very smooth flow from end to end focus is on all of the bow.
Great job.
That is a sweet bow design!
The antler overlays are awesome.
looks great tiller and nice all round. Maybe the long antler tips might add a bit more mass and drop a few FPS but doubt that would be an issue. :thumbsup:
Yeah I figured that too, but I'm not too worried about it. Wouldn't do this on someones bow that was a speed nut haha. And thanks for the kind words everybody! I'll get some more pics up today once I figure out how I want to do the last overlays. Need to make a proper string for it too.
Alright, so put in a lot of time refining the riser to make it fit the hand just right and cleaning stuff up. I decided to do black glass, macassar, and antler for my final overlays. Was a bit of a pain making the pieces for um, but after gluing up, here's what I had.
(http://s2.postimg.org/pn4wwy6i1/bowbuild_094.jpg)
And after some sanding and dremel action. Still have some cleaning up to do on them, but all the shaping is done. Also, notice that I mostly got the lines in the window cut to line up. Was a bit tricky, but ended up mostly working just fine. Will be much easier to keep everything lined up next time as I will be sure to do the I beams before cutting the riser block.
(http://s2.postimg.org/vqmhguwrt/bowbuild_099.jpg)
And from a couple more angles! This is just about the finished riser, just have to do a whole lot of sanding now!
(http://s2.postimg.org/4er8fis15/bowbuild_103.jpg)
(http://s2.postimg.org/k2sfmb7mx/bowbuild_104.jpg)
And I also shortened the tips by about a half inch each. They were just a bit outrageously long. Still long this way, but much less likely to break or catch on stuff.
(http://s2.postimg.org/ytn7k8bqh/bowbuild_101.jpg)
And that's it for today! Will get some shots up of the brace and draw once I make a proper string for it, and will put some more once it's got a finish on it! Thanks for following!! Hope someone out there finds it useful!
Put a finish on it last night. Little frustrated with the window, but everything else came out nice. This macassar is amazing, hard to capture with the camera. Overall extremely pleased with it, just got to get a proper string for it, should have it tomorrow or the next day. Will add brace and draw shots when that happens.
(http://s13.postimg.org/4r9wjctp3/bowforme.jpg)
(http://s13.postimg.org/czbu4cllj/bowforme2.jpg)
(http://s13.postimg.org/l3jy9380n/bowformelimb.jpg)
That's really nice! Those antler tip are insane!!
That's nice!
Looking sweet! What did you use for finish???
Thanks guys! I used thunderbird's quick drying poly. Intended to get thunderbird's epoxy, but bought the wrong stuff, though I really like the poly and will probably end up getting it again. Not sure yet. It's convenient being able to have a finished bow in 3 hours, and my current spraying setup (or lack thereof) makes it hard to keep dust and such out for long drying times.
Alright, so stripped the above poly finish off, inlayed crushed stone into the riser, and refinished with thunderbird epoxy. Here's the final shots. Shoots great, little touchy, but I think that might be a combo of my arrows being slightly off spine and my nock point being a tiny bit too high. Let me know if the picture size screws up the board at all.
(http://s12.postimg.org/eusnfmyil/bam.jpg)
(http://s12.postimg.org/4i6ctk4zh/bam2.jpg)
(http://s12.postimg.org/z0w5eiu65/bam3.jpg)
(http://s12.postimg.org/8ii3jjku5/bam4.jpg)
(http://s23.postimg.org/5bl603gu3/bowdoone.jpg)
(http://s23.postimg.org/4akxayzuj/bowdoonedraw.jpg)
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Those inlays are awesome!!!
Fantastic bow, I love your details and the uncommon design!
wow like the way you've done the stone inlays along with the bow in general. Different but excellent!
Smacking awesome. :) Bue--.
Thanks everyone! Got the hang of the inlays now, I think the next one will be a lot better. Got two in the works, will post some shots when they're done. Glad you guys get a kick out of it!
Wow! That is one awesome and unique bow! Those inlays are great.
nice piece of art work there ,love the shape of the bow and your craftsmanship. :thumbsup:
That is an amazing bow. I love the design, I'll be borrowing that tip overlay design if you don't mind. When I pay off my Kassai, I'd love a bow like that.
So when will we see Jormungandr?
Great job!!!