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Main Boards => The Bowyer's Bench => Topic started by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 08:42:00 PM

Title: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 08:42:00 PM
I have been perfectly happy makin and shootin D/R longbows, but awhile back I got a hankerin to build a recurve.   :dunno:  

I loosely based the riser deflex off a Kodiak Hunter.

From there out things are waaay different.

So different it may not work well. Its hard to string I already know....

I put some stuff in it that may or may not work.

The good thing is I cut some glass that had streaks on the end that I wouldn't ship out.

Its 60" and was shootin for 45 - 50@ 28....

So far it is 50@ 28 ,will prob be closer to 45 when done.....   :D
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Bob at Work on July 27, 2013, 08:45:00 PM
pics...pics...pics...     :bigsmyl:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 08:46:00 PM
Only got one, if p- bucket will let up on me a little!!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 08:51:00 PM
Profile.....

Note, my shop ain't like Roy's!  :biglaugh:  

 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d34/kennym/SANY0014_zpsa03df7e7.jpg) (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/kennym/media/SANY0014_zpsa03df7e7.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 08:52:00 PM
Won't look so rad when I get the tips chopped....
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: CardboardDuck on July 27, 2013, 08:58:00 PM
You can send it to me for testing  :)  Looks like a sweet shooter already  :)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Bob at Work on July 27, 2013, 09:12:00 PM
too cool...if you send it to Florida for testing...do it by way of Arkansas...    :thumbsup:  
Bob
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: JGR1269 on July 27, 2013, 09:14:00 PM
Jeez Kenny, I hope my questions a few weeks ago about wanting to build a short one piece recurve aren't to blame for your new venture. That looks like what I had in mind to build. I'll be watching to see how this turns out. Lookin good!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: bowhntineverythingnh03743 on July 27, 2013, 09:20:00 PM
Sweet!!!!! I'd test it for ya bud ... Bring on more pics.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: JamesV on July 27, 2013, 09:32:00 PM
Yep..............

About 6" off each end should do it.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: goobersan on July 27, 2013, 09:37:00 PM
looks good to me, but if you're worried about it breaking.....send it to 'ole Roy. I hear he's tough as nails
   :banghead:    :biglaugh:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: bigbob2 on July 27, 2013, 10:02:00 PM
looking good Kenny ,watching with interest!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: T Folts on July 27, 2013, 10:13:00 PM
Several people ask me when are you going to start making recurves and my response is never...
Looks good Kenny   :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 27, 2013, 11:18:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by goobersan:
looks good to me, but if you're worried about it breaking.....send it to 'ole Roy. I hear he's tough as nails
    :banghead:      :biglaugh:  
If I sent it to Ol Roy, it'd never break. He couldn't bend it that much!  :laughing:  

I probably won't ever like it as much as my longbows. But , a guy has to do what a guy has to do!!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Trux Turning on July 27, 2013, 11:29:00 PM
Welcome to the dark side... Make's you appreciate building a longbow.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: JamesV on July 27, 2013, 11:35:00 PM
Kenny..............

Once you get away from building longbows it becomes a slippery slope with the recurves, too many options and they are all fun to build and shoot. How long before we see a take-down model?

James
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: chackworth3 on July 28, 2013, 12:30:00 AM
I'm a little scared...   :eek:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: D on July 28, 2013, 12:36:00 AM
Heck yeah Kenny.  I've never tried building a curve but plan to....sometime.  It looks great so far.  I like the riser.  Get some more pics up..lolol
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: halfseminole on July 28, 2013, 12:42:00 AM
If it decides not to work for you, you can send it to me.  Not working for you might still run circles round my efforts.

Beautiful bow, don't think I've quite seen a design like it.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on July 28, 2013, 06:27:00 AM
I guess it's Ok. I love the blue limbs..  :laughing:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Crooked Stic on July 28, 2013, 08:35:00 AM
Well if you say you are nuts then maybe you are.
But the bow looks like it will be ok after you chop the tips a bit. What taper you got in it?
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 09:23:00 AM
Mike , it has .0025 plus a power lam and tip wedge, it is 1.5" wide. Not sure if I'm gonna have enuff stability.

Maybe shoulda stuck with .002  T....


I wuz out of pink Roy!  :D
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: ron w on July 28, 2013, 09:37:00 AM
Looks pretty good to me....can't wait to see it all finished up!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: BrushWolf on July 28, 2013, 10:06:00 AM
:thumbsup:    :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Trux Turning on July 28, 2013, 10:31:00 AM
Kenny you should be fine at that taper with the tip wedges- you just need to cut some off the tips. It looks like they are in front of the riser too much and with the 1.5" width stability is a big problem. I make a skinny 60" recurve similar to yours with a .002 taper and a straight taper from fades to the tips.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: LittleBen on July 28, 2013, 11:00:00 AM
Kenny, take my input with a grain of salt since I haven't built a glass bow, but I have built wood recurves.

I think based on where your string grooves are cut, you should be ok with stability. The string grooves look about 1" in front of the back of the riser. That's shouldn't be too extreme. Might be more finicky to tiller, or you might need a bit more brace height to get the stability up, but might not even be a problem at all.

1.5" wide should be fine, If you haven't tapered the limbs yet I might consider keeping them slightly wider at mid limb than a straight taper to the tips would give you.

I've made two red oak recurves which were only 1.5" wide, and both have the tips about 3" forward of the back of the bow, and have no deflex other than the bit of set that they took. The first one I made basically a straight taper to the tips (pyrimidal) and it was a bear to tiller, had to use heat to align the tips after tillering. The second was full width to 10" from the tips, then tapered to 1/2" nocks. That bow had basically zero stability problems even though is is fairly narrow and highly recurved.

I would consider doing something in between the two of those. Now on most of my bows I make a straight taper from the fades to 1" wide at the tips. Then I make a second taper line starting at 10-12" from the tips and tapering to 3/8-1/4" at the tips. Once I cut the profile out to those lines, I blend the area around mid-limb where the two taper lines meet, so it a nice smooth rounded transition; it almost looks 'oval' when you're done. This way I get a little more mid limb width, and still taper nicely to a narrow tip. Greatly improves stability over a single straight taper, and shouldn't impact speed much because your limb tips remain narrow. I hope that description was clear.

Good luck, and as usual the bow looks great.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on July 28, 2013, 03:48:00 PM
Kenny you are not nuts, your only half nuts..  :laughing:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 04:21:00 PM
The nocks are filed in, the xtra tips are waaay out there tho.

I started taper 10" back from nocks and it looks good braced, haven't seen it at full draw yet.....
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 08:59:00 PM
Shot it a little tonite, it didn't set my feathers on fire ....

Really, I have no idea how the performance is, its 5# heavier than my D/R

Pretty quiet with the $1 string I got at mojam , actually a rope, 22 strands.....

Nocks wont hardly go on it, but I think 65-70 # woods are gonna work on it.

The bottom limb string tracks off about 3/16 when shot, so I gotta look at the nocks and the limb layout to see if anything jumps out on it.

When that's done, I'll put some grooves in the belly glass to catch the string, when I know it wants to go to center of limb anyway.

Then I start tweaking handle and shelf to suit me.

Its still 50# @ 28"

I'll get a strung pic in a minute and a fulldraw too...
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: David Flanrey on July 28, 2013, 09:01:00 PM
Lookin good to me Kenny.  Sometime the unknown things are alot of fun to figure out.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 09:15:00 PM
 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d34/kennym/SANY0015_zps0d1bd006.jpg) (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/kennym/media/SANY0015_zps0d1bd006.jpg.html)

 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d34/kennym/SANY0017_zpsdfe347c3.jpg) (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/kennym/media/SANY0017_zpsdfe347c3.jpg.html)

 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d34/kennym/SANY0016_zps040d44b8.jpg) (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/kennym/media/SANY0016_zps040d44b8.jpg.html)

Please ignore my fashion statement, I'm tryin for ground hunting, camo bottom, blue sky top...  :laughing:  

 (http://i32.photobucket.com/albums/d34/kennym/SANY0019_zps818ca017.jpg) (http://s32.photobucket.com/user/kennym/media/SANY0019_zps818ca017.jpg.html)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 09:18:00 PM
Full draw looks fair to me, whatcha think?

Better if the tips unrolled a bit more? Or is stiff tips good on a curve? Need some ideas to improve her!!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: D on July 28, 2013, 09:29:00 PM
I wouldn't have paid any attention to your clothing choice if you wouldn't have said anything about it first.  Good lord is all I've got to say...lol  But the bow looks great.  I don't know much about recurves (or other bows for that matter) but the full draw looks pretty good to me.  I think you have done an awesome job.  As always.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Dan Bonner on July 28, 2013, 10:00:00 PM
Kenny, that's a great looking design! A narrow limb one piece RC is the toughest glass bow to build and you nailed it. I don't see anything radicle about the design but I bet it will be 20fps faster with a skinny string. Should be smooth. The  tip wedges keep a good string angle at full draw. You will be amazed how much difference the string grooves make in stability once you file them. How much working limb do you have from fade to tip wedge?

Bonner
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 28, 2013, 10:07:00 PM
Thanks guys!!

Well, it has a special lam I've worked up for my D/Rs  in it.

It started life as a .001 taper, then I added a tip wedge and power lam to it and made a sled to grind em.

It has about .009 taper for the first 12" and last 12" on a 36" lam  .

That made it really thick on the very ends so I paralleled it for about 8" , so I didn't get out past the riser tip.

It works well in my D/Rs from 58 to 64" and the lams for this one are 30" from the center to nock,and I skived about 1/2" to glue the lams up at center so I guess I have about 6 1/2" of tip wedge, you can see that it gets thicker at end of limb.

Do you mean the grooves on the belly the string lands in?
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Dan Bonner on July 28, 2013, 11:02:00 PM
Yes sir,  the belly grooves. They help a lot. I really like the bow. I have been building all of my prototypes out of action wood lately also. I just hate to risk a good riser block. What did you use for your I beam? Phenolic?

Bonner
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on July 28, 2013, 11:35:00 PM
Ya don't know how to make strings, son? LOL

22 strands of what, B-50 no doubt?
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 29, 2013, 09:35:00 PM
Yes Roy, but it was sooo cheap!! $1.00

Dan, that is a 1/4" black sammiched by 2- 1/16" red for the I-beam. Adds some stiffness to the riser.....
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: ron w on July 29, 2013, 10:13:00 PM
:thumbsup:    :thumbsup:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 29, 2013, 10:21:00 PM
Thanks Ron, it aint over yet, but I think it will make a shooter!! LOL
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: jsweka on July 29, 2013, 11:32:00 PM
Nice looking bow Kenny.  Now those pants........
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: chackworth3 on July 29, 2013, 11:50:00 PM
Don't have a lot of experience with recurves but it looks good to me Kenny!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: bigbob2 on July 30, 2013, 12:54:00 AM
Yup doin fine there Kenny!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: MoeM on July 30, 2013, 03:06:00 AM
Nice one Kenny! But you really hadn`t have to design it from the very start- Swissbow`s been sharing instructions for a while (even in English). Looks close to yours but is much shorter.
  Andys Recurve BA (pdf) (http://www.swissbow.com/swissbow_eng/download_eng_files/Build%20Along%20Recurve%2052_ENG.pdf)  
But you`ve both shown that LB guys can do a great job on recurves too!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on July 30, 2013, 06:28:00 AM
OMG, I'm speechless.. Just love the outfit, Kenny..  Those your jammies, son?  :laughing:  

    (http://i47.photobucket.com/albums/f165/ROY-CHRIS/kennym.jpg) (http://s47.photobucket.com/user/ROY-CHRIS/media/kennym.jpg.html)

Bow looks very nice too:)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: carpin'mark on July 30, 2013, 06:15:00 PM
That is a great looking design Kenny, I think the full draw looks really good, nice smooth 'S' curve.
Now you just need to put a 'real' string on there and it will really wake up. B50 is good for old bows and shoelaces!
Once you get that badboy dialed in, I'll bet your longbows start to collect a little dust.
You mentioned it was hard to string, if your using one of the LB stringers with a rubber pad on it, you might want to try using the double cup/boot type.  They compress the limbs evenly just like you were drawing the bow.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Crooked Stic on July 30, 2013, 06:59:00 PM
OMG  :scared:  I guess that bow really looks good compared to your outfit. Althought you would look right in place at Wal-mart  :bigsmyl:  
That bow looks really good strung and unstrung and as mentioned a skinnier string will help a bunch. There are many ways to do curves taper wise. I settled on a .001 taper with no powerlam or tip wedge. I have built them with no taper and .002s also . Those narrow ones are a bit more touchier on getting good tiller.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on July 30, 2013, 07:39:00 PM
I try to stay outta Walmart, I might end up in one o those emails!! LOL

I gotta get time to make a string and tune on the nocks a bit. And make the grip smaller, it is pretty huge right now!!

And Roy , those "would" be my jammies if I wore any....  :D  Just my evening clothing.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: dfrois on July 30, 2013, 07:44:00 PM
Way to go, Kenny!! Except for the outfit...

Stiff tips on recurves add speed, but diminish the relief on draw force that unrolling tips provide. Stiff also makes the limbs stack earlier, and make the rest of the limb bend more, with all else equal...but your string angle seems good, perhaps a tad on the acute side. I bet a normal FF string will make it put to shame many a similar longbow, at least in speed. If you find out, please let us know. Wonderful job, but then again, everybody knew you would do well!

DF
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: JJB on July 30, 2013, 09:51:00 PM
I think everything about it looks good Kenny, great work as usual!
-Jay
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on August 01, 2013, 10:44:00 PM
Would you believe a different string make a diff in how the limbs come back to brace? Top one is now perfect and bottom barely off. Gonna be easy to tweak into shape, bow will end up about 47 # I think.  Shoots 65-70 arrows real good right now.

And (gulp), carries the mail out to 30 yards too....

I'm kinda likin it so far. Need to reduce handle a bit tho, which was planned from the start. Was gonna make it like a Martin(I think that's the one) where the bottom of the grip is cut behind the back glass just a bit...
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 02, 2013, 01:11:00 AM
That's what ya get for putting a $1.00 string on it, Son:) The string had to be crooked...  :laughing:
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Crooked Stic on August 02, 2013, 02:34:00 AM
Might have been a string groove binding issue with the fat string.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Troy D. Breeding on August 02, 2013, 04:27:00 PM
You did good Kenny.  :thumbsup:  

Troy
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on August 02, 2013, 06:51:00 PM
Heck Roy, ya couldn't hardly bend that string!! LOL

Mike, I kinda thought that too, but the new string cured that and its down to 47.5# I think I need to block sand the edge of the bottom limb, so it will maybe still be 47#

Thanks Troy!!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 03, 2013, 12:34:00 AM
47 is purty stiff for an ole boy:)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on August 03, 2013, 11:40:00 AM
Not sendin you this one anyway Roy....  :D  

Found my little limb twist prob, it is in the nock groove...
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 03, 2013, 11:42:00 AM
So your gonna paint it pink and hunt wif it? :)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: kennym on August 03, 2013, 05:09:00 PM
I may, it shoots nice, and not loud as I thought it would be!

Here is the chrony tale...

600 grain fletched arrow (65-70 spine)from Snag

45# @ 28" set up to hunt with brass nock and 4 silencers on a 12 strand D97 with padded loops and  padded center serving

13.3333 grain per #

mechanical release on shootin machine

159 fps avg half dozen shots

That's 10 fps faster than my D/R with same arrow !!

Wish I had a 9 gpp just for kicks, but my arras are all huntin stuff.

Now I feel bad, may have to do sumpin to the D/R...   :D  

Nah, I ain't chasin the speed wagon, if you can get a nice shooter that is quiet, speed is third on the list!!

We'll see how she does outside for noise.   :)
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: dfrois on August 03, 2013, 05:24:00 PM
WOW! 160 fps with such a heavy arrow is *very* good! Congratulations on a great job.

DF
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Roy from Pa on August 03, 2013, 09:28:00 PM
Not too shabby ole boy.
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: chackworth3 on August 04, 2013, 10:19:00 AM
Very nice with 13+ gpp!
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: heartlandbowyer on August 04, 2013, 08:22:00 PM
Sound like a keeper Kenny, sounds pretty quick for shooting telephone poles. Get er sanded and sprayed so we can see 1 of the 2 bows your hunting with this fall. Johns trade bow is gonna have to share time with that curve.

Cory
Title: Re: Thats it, I'm NUTS ----TEST result p 4
Post by: Razorbak on August 04, 2013, 10:58:00 PM
That's a awesome bow Kenny..you sure know how to make them that's for sure