Maaayyybe!
57 1/2" ttt, 55 1/2" ntn, bendy handle (bends in the handle too much right now but getting better). 38# @ 26". One and 3/8 " wide at the handle. 3/8" nocks with elk antler tip overlays. Selfow as of right now. (Except for the overlays, I love antler overlays).
Plans are to put a few layers of sinew on, probably 3 layers. It has some reflex in the tips, after many attempts to get the lower limb to keep it with heat treatment, and some deflex in the handle. Had read in TBBIV about putting a crown of sinew down the center of a bow,and feathering to the edges, and keep it off the last several inches.
I figure the sinew will help with the "bends too much in the handle" situation, then I will finish tillering after that.
With the elk tip overlays, elk sinew, elk leather handle wrap and a couple of elk ivory embellishment, I'm thinking the name "Wapiti" would be appropriate. It is a bow given as a prize for winning the fry pan toss at our last powwow.
Pictures? Is someone thinking "pictures?"? I'm working on it. (Frustration! :banghead: ) Having technical difficulties in that area. Oooh the suspense!
Make sure and put a few extra courses of sinew at the handle. Pictures!!! :)
Thanks John, makes sense now that you mention it!
Looking forward to the pics B
B you got us all ready to see that bow now come on with it already.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture097.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture098.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture099.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture100.jpg)
Accually, not bending too much in the handle, but not bending enough in the mid-limb areas.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture104.jpg)
She looks better in your hand than on the tiller tree. You could get the outside 1/2 bending a bit more but if she shoots well, just shoot her as she is. Well done.
Thanks Pat. The pic of the bow on the tree is @ 18". I'm at fulldraw which is 26". And I think I took more off the mid-limbs before the fulldraw pic.
I still think I will sinew her like I mentioned up top. Crown it with sinew and keep the outer 5-6" bare. She has some set in the handle. What do you think of me heat bending some of that out before sinewing?
If you are going to sinew back it put a little reflex in it while sinewing. It should hold just fine like that. Like John said, put a bit extra at the handle.
Heating in reflex would also be an option. You don't have a lot of set from the looks in the unbraced pic.
I leave the tips bare of sinew also. Be sure to do a wrap at each end so it doesn't pull up while drying or afterwards when drawing. You can do a temporary wrap with thread for now until you are sure the tiller is right but remove that and add a permanent sinew wrap. That can be covered with thread to dress it up just before the finish id added or leave it like it is with just the sinew wrap.
Make sure and get as much mass as possible off the last 6" or so. I think I'd have to get just a touch more bend midlimb but it should be fine like it is. Cool bow. That's one of my favorite designs.
Pat, I was thinking the same thing, that a wrap to help hold the backing down and the tip end would be beneficial. Some red silk thread would look great over that too if I do it right.
I've been thinking I can take some wood off under the overlays. And I'm wondering if I should make the last 6" more narrow.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture106.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture107.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture108.jpg)
First is an attempt to show the not so perfect string tracking. Part of it is the bad shot angle. This stave had a mild twist and a side ways "C" shape.
Then the width of the outer limbs and then the thickness in the outer limbs.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture.jpg)
A picture of the attempt to take the set out of the handle.
The "C" that appeared to come back or maybe I thought it looked better than it really was, was heat bent out again.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture110.jpg)
The string tracks better now I think, although it's hard to tell with this photo.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture111.jpg)
I have worked on the tips to get them lighter. The bottom tip has a little twist to it but I can make it work with a deeper groove on the appropriate side.
I've been thinking about other names for her. Artimas (sp) was the name of the goddess Diana before it was Diana. Goddess of wild things and places. A bow made by a woman for a woman.....
I'm waiting for the elk leg sinew that I ordered to arrive. I'm hoping to have the bow exactly ready so I can go directly to processing sinew. The set came back some that I tried to heat out, just from bracing it once. So I will wait for the sinew to do that for me.
Next I want to flip the tips a bit. They already have a bit of a fipped look because of the tip overlays.
I'm looking into natural pigments to decorate the back.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture112.jpg)
I made a form that is a copy of John S's. I just kicked the tips a bit. I raised a splinter on the upper tip (probably should cut string grooves AFTER flipping or recurving). I didn't use the metal strip on it thinking it would not be needed when just flipping. I used the strip on the lower limb and no splinters. They don't look exactly even to me.
The upper limb is on the left. I definitely need to give it a bit more.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture113.jpg)
That's better!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture115.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture116.jpg)
But now I have a splinter to fix. I put thin CA in it already. I'm thinking I can sand that down a little and maybe add a little more and it will hold. What do you think?
i cant really see it that well , but if its not too deep , as long as your tips arent moving (much) , a thread wrap might be all you need.
looks great , show me yer form...
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture118.jpg)
This is the form that I tried to copy from John Scifres osage recurve video tutorial thread. It may not be exact but it did the trick. I just didn't take it all the way back into a recurve. I stopped and held it about halfway.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture117.jpg)
Here is my pile of elk leg sinew on the leather that I may use for the handle wrap. Twenty pieces, I hope it's enough. I will start processing it soon.
Rear leg sinew from an elk kinda smells bad, go figure. If the first piece I processed is any indication twenty should be plenty!
Bona, when you get the sinews shreaded give it a good wash in warm water and Dawn dish soap just before sinewing your bow. It will degrease the sinew and help to get rid of the smells too.
Sounds like a good idea Pat. I don't remember the deer sinew I worked smelling like this. :)
If it wasn't stored correctly and had the least bit of moisture still in it it will begin to smell. I have some shreaded sinew that a friends kids shreaded and I traded with them. I noticed a smell when I got it. Not bad but I didn't want it to get bad. I sat the sinew in a sunny window in my sunroom and let it dry for a few more days before putting it back in aziploc bag.+
I like storing mine in an bucket with some cedar shavings and a tight lid.
I use moose sinew which is a touch longer than elk. It takes 4 legs worth to do a bow, maybe 3 good courses.
I used to assume 8 deer legs to do a bow. Elk should be in the middle so assume 6. Looks like you have plenty. Where did you order it?
The place is called Eidnes Furs out of Idaho or Utah, one of those states. I have gotten pretty good service from them. I don't think they offer moose sinew, where do you get moose.
I've get about 4 pieces done so far, (coarsely done).
I also got some bear rawhide. It's pretty thin. I'm hoping it will make good backing for a pecan board bow.
Also, I've research natural pigments again and have come up with a load of good info. I want to "paint" the back of some bows including this one. Blood makes a nice red on sinew.
My muscles and hands are sore from processing this sinew but I think I have enough now. I'm hoping to get the bow sinewed tomorrow.
The sinewing is done.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture131.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture130.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture129.jpg)
I took the deflex out of the center of the bow before hand and I hope that the drying will induce some reflex. Extra sinew in the handle area. And I used TBIII. It's in the house where the RH is 45%.
I think I figured out what makes this sinew extra smelly. Besides the smell of manure and urine it smells like....moth balls. Yuck! I washed it before hand in Dawn dish soap like Pat suggested.
Now I wait.
Coming along nicely, Bona.
Thanks Pat. I'm kinda feeling like John is about his perfect bow. This is definitely one of the coolest bows I've made. It is sitting just off to my right and I keep looking at it, willing the sinew to cure.
I've tried that with little luck! d;^) Fortunately at this time of year the air is pretty dry and you will notice a change tomorrow and the next few days after that. Once the sinew gets transparent it makes it harder to leave it along because it doesn't seem to change much. You will probably notice some reflex being drawn in though.
I just got home from work. It is just five hrs from being 24 hrs since I started the sinewing. It is now more of a brown color and has hardened quite a bit. The only spot that still has alot of give is in the handle where I put extra courses. I can now see some places that need another strip or so added on the opposite side from where I sat yesterday. There are some grooves in it.
Bona, use your next course to fill in the voids and bare spots and to even up the sinew backing.
If you would run your fingers or a wet dowel over the sinew and it's drying out it'll have less voids and seperations in it.......Art
we need some auvtomat bots to compile all these little tips...
wonderful looking sinew. i was going to purchase 20 deer sinew too , but i might have a buddy with moose...
a+ bona.
Pat, I did that this morning. Ended up being almost another full course. I see one maybe two more spots that will need it.
Art B., I did some of that also this time and its looking pretty smooth.
Hova, I need to find some moose. John needs to give up his moose source. I like making bows with a theme so to speak. I want to make a "bear" bow next. Bear rawhide, bear grease finish and bear claw hanging from the grip. Then there's bison...
I've had to put more sinew on in spots. One spot was thin that I noticed after taking the bow off the form. To be able to see the bow from all angles under better lighting was helpful. There is one small place with a gap I want to fill then I'll be happy with the job.
Looking good, can't wait to see how it finishes!
I did the initial sinewing on the 18th so it's been about a week. I have flexed the limbs on the floor a little just to see how it's feeling. I'm trying to leave it alone.
In the mean time I have begun to repair the sinew bow that I started last spring, my first attempt at sinewing. It is ERC with one course of sinew with hide glue. It fell out of the hot box from an elevation of about 5.5' and split the limb from tip to about 7-8 in., stopping at the sinewed back.
It's been laying around the garage ever since, I've been trying to decide what to do with it when I suddenly had a brain storm. Why not glue it back down!? So I did. There was also a chip out of the tip so I had to file both tips down to put an underlay on.
It has really reflexed from being taken from 70% humidity to 45%.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture132.jpg)
I wanted to show you a view of the crown of sinew on the scrap osage wood bow.
I've been pretty patient waiting for it to cure. Doing other projects while I wait.
Here is the red cedar bow I'm repairing. What is your opinion on this knot? Should I take it down some more?
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture133.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture134.jpg)
Where is it in the limb?
It is mid, lower limb.
Well, on this redcedar bow I'm working on while the osage bow's sinew cures, I checked the limb length and the lower limb is 3" shorter than the upper limb. That was a problem last year that I thought I had corrected. I strung it and the tiller is wild. The upper limb has a lot more bend and there is too much in the mid limb. Looks like I need to cut off an inch or inch and a half, reapply the tip overlay and see what I get.
Well...the lower limb on the cedar bow snapped. It's been nearly 2 weeks since the sinew was put on the osage bow. How long do I have to wait?
Bona, I waited a month between layers of sinew and put down 3 layers.
Once it looks dry(transparent) you should be able to tell by flexing the limbs. If they feel mushy give it a bit longer.
I pretty much put it all on at one time...so to wait 3 months before I string it makes sense to me but...Oy!..it's kill'n me. I've got to work on another project. It's not like I don't have plenty to do.
Put it somewhere out of sight. d;^) I kept mine on top of our gas hot water heater in the utility room.
I put all of my sinew on at one time and have it strung after 4 weeks if Im in a hurry but like a couple of months to dry. It will keep picking up weight over the next four months as the sinew cures more and if it gets cold it will gain more weight. But it is fine to put on all the sinew at once and string it after a month on normal amounts of sinew.
I let mine dry in a normal room the first two weeks then in a drier place the next two weeks. But you don't want to rush it at the first the sinew on the outside will dry too fast and could lift off the rest from the bow in an extreme case.
I like this bow Bona, good job!
Thanks Mike! Hey, you add a painted design to your bows don't you? Do you use natural pigments? I go back and forth about decorating this bow. Since it's not flat maybe I shouldn't.
Pat, I will put it in my hot box. That will keep it out of sight! Thanks!
Looks good, bona. Ya'll are makin' me want to try sinew on a bow.
Stan
It's been a month today since the initial sinewing. Here she is at this point.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture178.jpg)
At low brace of 5".
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture182.jpg)
At 18" draw. She measures 30# @ 20" and I plan to go to 26".
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture183.jpg)
Just unbraced.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture179.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture180.jpg)
The second tip here needed a deeper groove on the left side.
So...what do you think?
Looks good B!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture185.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v210/BonaGlass/Picture188.jpg)
Braced at 6 3/4" and full draw. 42# @ 26". Shot a 417gr arrow 135 yds.
In TBBIV, it mentions that if a 50# bow shoots a 500 gr arrow 150 yds that equals 170 fps. My own personal performance goal is to take the wt of the bow, add 100 and that should be the yds a decent bow should shoot. So I feel like this bow comes close to that. Can you say that this bow probable shoots 155 fps?
Just read through this thread...great stuff, makes me want to start gathering all the odds & ends for cooking up some hide glue and sinew prep.
Are you still planning on doing some natural pigment additions to the bow?
Looks good, B.
Stan
She looks nice Bona. Tiller is good and she has pleasant lines. Well done!...and from a scrap!
Loos very nice bglass! No help here with the fps thing tho. How do you shoot the bow to get the distance accurate every time? It seems to me that it would be diferent in every case depending on the terrain of angle of the bow. Just curious is all.
That is great work. Very nicely done. Jawge
Thanks all!
Mike,it is not accurate at all. It depends on type of draw and release, wind direction and speed...I try to shoot several arrows and average out the distances. A chronograph would be most accurate but I don't have one. I'm not a speed freak but I want my bows to have some good performance. Also this bow is not broken in which makes a difference. I'm guessing it will end up at 40#. It shoots nice for bending in the handle I didn't notice any hand shock.
Yes Lee I am working on the paint right now.
I got some "paint" on it but I don't like it. Plan is to sand it off and maybe go with acrylics this time.
beauty of a "scrap" bow. kind of funny how a chunk of osage scrap can make a 42lb bow. love the flipped tips. just a real nice job
Thanks rainshooter!
Just checked in and found your bow, Bona. Excellent work all the way around! I love the classic, smooth lines and the spot-on tiller. :)
Thanks 4est! I'm kinda proud of this one. The other one I'm working on has me humbled though. :o
Now I'm reeeally humbled! I got a new bow scale and it turns out that this bow is actually 52" @ 26"! It's hard telling how many bows I've made heavier than they actually are! I don't know if it was the scale or just my poor vision trying to read it while trying to hold it at the correct length at the same time. The digital display is much easier to read.
Check your scale by compairing it to a scale you know to be correct, those digital scales may not be accurate.The digitals I have read all over the place.Just a thought to help you out.Great job on the bow and I'v enjoyed this tread. Hope to be trying my hand at sinew backing soon.Hope it turns out as nice as yours.
Thanks Knawbone!