Any carpenters here? I have an estimate for a 20 x 20 building with treated wood floor on concrete pillars, 8 ft walls, barn style roof, no drywall, insulation or elctric run to it or in it. They shot me $10,875.00.
What do you think?
I paid 3k for my shop 10 x 15 with loft and work bench.
I have the estimate in a pdf if anyone wants to look at it. I can't get concrete to where I want my shop so a treated wood floor is my only option I guess. I also had them figure a garage style roll up door in with that.
I have a customer who just had a 24 x 30 put up last summer. Concrete floor, rock fill, 16 x 7 overhead garage door, 3' man door, pole barn style construction. $ 10,500 +-. In your case the treated wood floor is quite a bit more expensive than concrete.
Why can't you get concrete to the site if ya dont mind me asking? Lots of variables can get you going up or down, pice wise, in a building that size.
Jim, have you looked into renting a concrete pump? We use them all the time at work.They'll pump uphill and at great distances.
Jim, my shop is 24 x 64 with a heated slab floor, pole barn construction and super insulated for Iowa winters - cost about what you had quoted. I am a carpenter, made my own trusses and did all the labor, so that cut the cost about in half. Still, you quote sounds high as construction labor rates are low in OK and builders are in the midst of a depression and should be begging for work.
Note, if you can't get a concrete truck to your site, there will be lots of other logistic problems during building and after.
What part of OK are you in? I would be happy to review your pdf and comment. shaunw@aol.com
You can also rent motorized concrete buggies on tracks to get the ready mix to the location. If you can get the rest of the materials there, you can get the 'crete there. I'm a bit curious to see the estimate myself. Is this just a stick frame building?
btw that sounds steep for a bare bones building. A gambrel roof will raise costs, but there are plenty of options to save $. Shaun's building is evidence of that. There's plenty of companies looking for work. Shop around. Maybe you know a carpenter who can help out for extra cash?
Ok guys thanks. Tom and Shaun, I'll email you the file tonight.
The ground from the street to my back yard is super soft. I have buried two pick ups there in the past. I'm pretty sure a concrete truck or pump truck would be even worse.
I'm about 15 miles from the Tulsa city limits.
I am a touch over 10k with mine. 18x20, concrete floor. I am doing the finish work myself, insulation, wiring and wall sheeting. Could be done by now if we'd get out of these dang negative temps.
My 20x24 cost about that. Treated and insulated floor on concrete pillars, 10' walls (a very nice upgrade), insulated and sheathed in cdx inside.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/Random/workshop1.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/Random/th_DSCN1817.jpg) (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v212/fliksr/Random/?action=view¤t=DSCN1817.jpg)
This shop cost me 19K about 7 years ago. 28X30 concrete floor, bug treated, insulated and paneled on my shop side side, wired, with a floored in loft.
Things cost less in Bama.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v181/ekrewson/shopoutside.jpg)
Wow those are nice shops! I'm curious to see what the next builder quotes.
Look around the Bartlesville area. I bet there are some builders there that will be cheaper. Check references.
This builder is out of Bartlesville and Jenks.
I found this add on craigslist.
30'x 50'x 10' metal building with concrete installed on your level location $15,950.00
Includes:
~ 4 inch cement slab with 3/8" rebar on 3'centers and 9" thickened edge
~ 14 gauge all steel welded frame with uprights and trusses on 5' centers
~ 26 gauge colored sheet metal with full trim package and nearly 20 colors to choose from (Panels have 40yr warranty)
~ 1-3.0'x 7.0' flush metal door with knob
~ Framed and trimmed opening for overhead door (door extra)
ALL STEEL FRAMING NO WOOD
They were pumping some concrete at our base today. I talked to the guys and explained my situation. They have hoses that they can pump concrete along the ground too. I'll have to buy an extra yard but I can pour it how ever I want.
It dropped the price losing the wooden floor but with the pump truck and concrete it went back up about $1400, for a total of 11,400. I think I'll finish the inside myself to include the wiring rough in. I think I'd be money ahead in the long run with concrete. I'll never have to replace the floor.
I might as well have what I want to work in for the rest of my life.
Jim, check out Indaco buildings in Shawnee,Ok. I bought the 30x50kit with 14' walls and built it for around 12,000 7 years ago with a 6" thick concrete floor, unisulated though. If you only go 10' walls it would be a lot cheaper. I did put it up myself.
Sounds like a good deal now, I wasn't likin that wood floor. I won't even tell you how much my shop was, but it is steel, price kinda goes up with steel. :rolleyes:
My shop is 27 X 13. Concrete floor, 8 inch block outside, insulated to heck and back, studded out with 2X4's. Trusses for the roof, 4 X 8 OSB interior walls and ceiling, did not skimp on anything. I have about $9,000.00 in it.
My shop is almost done,yeah!
15'x25' concrete,electric,2"x6" walls,vaulted ceiling, cedar siding,insulation,Sheetrock,labor for one guy to help me and I'm at 13K
Price is now $11,417 for 20 x 20 with concrete floor.
28.54 a square foot is pretty good I think. Every area is different. I dont think I could get one put up around me for that. Hope it comes together for ya. Hope you take pics along the way. I love seeing a good shop come up, especially when I know there will be some trad archery goings on!!
I'm pretty stoked about getting it built!
Talked to another guy about building a shop. I think he's just a contractor that hires guys for different parts of the job. I asked him for a ball park price and he rambled on for about 5 minutes about this and the cost of that.. blah blah.... He finally spit out 15-20K!! I politely declined his services.
I'm meeting with the other "builder" on Thursday to get this ball rolling. I like this guy and his attention to what I want and need.
The ball is now officially rolling! Once my back yard is dry enough for them to get the materials in there it should only be about two weeks till I have a new work shop! I'm really excited about it!
Mueller Inc. prefab buildings are pretty good and not a bad price. http://www.muellerinc.com/building/prefab_kits.php
Make sure that any excavation/backfill is included, if needed. Of course, they need to be bonded and insured in your state, and ask who needs to get the building permit. Get references. Lastly, check out the builder. Make sure there are no skeletons in the closet. You can ask the building inspector in their home area if they've had any problems with them.
Update: Shop should be done this Thursday. Still have to wire and sheetrock it though. I'll post pics when I get them resized.
Congrats on your new playroom. :bigsmyl: Did you have to get a permit?
Yeah we went with a concrete slab so it is permanent. Glad we did too. It was actually cheaper than a wood floor!
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1269.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1271.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1314.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1316.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1329.jpg)
Looking great Jim...lots of storage up top!
Yeah it's over six foot at the peak inside. The fold down ladder will make it easy to get up and down there.
I think I'll build a work bench along that back wall with cabinets on either side of the window. I'm really excited about it all!
They sprayed the primer/sealer on it and put the roll up door in today.
Nice looking shop Jim.
Terry
Jim when I finished the inside of my garage, instead of using sheetrock I used OSB plywood (smooth side out). I took my time on the cuts and I caulked all the joints and filled the nail holes. I then primed and painted it and I you cannot really tell the difference between it and sheetrock. As this OSB is so cheap right now it is actually cheaper to do it than sheetrock and definetely more durable. The only thing is local fire codes may require sheetrock but that all depends on where you live I suppose.
QuoteOriginally posted by bjansen:
Jim when I finished the inside of my garage, instead of using sheetrock I used OSB plywood (smooth side out). I took my time on the cuts and I caulked all the joints and filled the nail holes. I then primed and painted it and I you cannot really tell the difference between it and sheetrock. As this OSB is so cheap right now it is actually cheaper to do it than sheetrock and definetely more durable. The only thing is local fire codes may require sheetrock but that all depends on where you live I suppose.
I wouldn't worry about local codes regarding the interior finish and fire rating. Fir ratings are typically used in commercial and multi-residential applications. Although some southern ordinances require sprinklers (Snottsdale is one of em) seeing snow on his lawn is a good indication that he's cool with finishing however.
I saw osb here for I think $7 a sheet. It's also nice when it comes to fastening to the walls, cause you don't have to really worry about locating studs.
Helluva shop there Razor. Glad you went with the concrete and the gambrel roof. Don't forget to insulate! lol
One more suggestion, put in twice as many lights as you think you need. I have one end of my shop I sure wish I had stuck another florescent 48"er in, kinda' dark down there.
I did put an abundance of 120v and 220v plugs around the walls, as well as a 100amp breaker box.
Lookin good! Wife and I are planning a gambrel roof storage/shop as well.
Planning on an outlet every 6 feet. I was leaning toward plywood for the interior over sheetrock due to moisture. I was planning on using the high output T8 flouresents.
Thanks for the ideas guys. I'm ready to start customizing!
I also used OSB for my interior walls and ceilings with sprayed white paint. I ran my electrical wiring on the surface with romex - not to code for a "living space" but fine for a shop. This avoids all the drilling studs, pulling wires and especially all the penetrations. As my bro-in-law says "its just electricity - nothing to be ashamed of." The new T8 lights are great and get the fancy electronic non ballast models that don't hummmmmmm. And the highest number rating for the bulbs - the "sunlight" type make a great color of light.
Ya baby!!!!!! Lookin goooood!!!!!! :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
QuoteOriginally posted by Eric Krewson:
One more suggestion, put in twice as many lights as you think you need. I have one end of my shop I sure wish I had stuck another florescent 48"er in, kinda' dark down there.
I did put an abundance of 120v and 220v plugs around the walls, as well as a 100amp breaker box.
Definitely a GREAT suggestion Mr. K! I'd say a fixture every 72" o.c. with 36" at your walls. Man I hate the lighting in my shop. Some spots if I work a certain way my body actually shields the light i need! Try to avoid that Razor.
I looked it over today. I'm going with two T8's end to end over my work bench on the back wall(19'5"). Two more every 4 foot or so toward the front where the garage door is. I'll have them there too so when the door is down I won't have a dark spot there. So eight 8ft lights total in 400 square feet. I should be able to tan in there.
QuoteOriginally posted by razorsharptokill:
I looked it over today. I'm going with two T8's end to end over my work bench on the back wall(19'5"). Two more every 4 foot or so toward the front where the garage door is. I'll have them there too so when the door is down I won't have a dark spot there. So eight 8ft lights total in 400 square feet. I should be able to tan in there.
lol. Don't forget to invite the honies!! Some Jimmy Buffet and a few dozen bows scattered about and you got yourself a party!
Have you built you bench yet? You might want to think about making a walk around bench rather than one up against a wall. I built one up against the wall but later built a walk around and am much happier with it.
The top is a 4 X 8 sheet of 3/4 ply wih 4X4 legs, 2X6s as a frame at the top and 2X4s to hold a shelf at the bottom. Heavy enough not to hop around and with a vice mounted at the corner and a support down from it it is easy to work and walk around.
Just a thought. Great looking shop by the way.
TBKII
PS: Think about what kind of vice you will get.
Now that you have a real shop, you should consider shopnotes magazine. This link is to a sample mag, and in it are plans to build a bench worthy of an true woodworker. Click the next button above the cover to flip through the pages, the site makes it look like it's just a cover page.
http://www.shopnotes.com/issues/sample/01/
Unless you already know about the mag...
Thanks fish, I went ahead and subscribed. I have a 6' bench my dad made years ago that is super sturdy. It is almost exactly as you described Tim. He had it in his basement and it was set up as a walk around. I like that idea.
I was considering the spray on expandable foam insulation but I think I'll just do the fiberglass roll.
I rolled another coat of Kilz on the outside today. Looks much better. I'll spray a good oil based exterior paint on it as soon as I can.
Make that four 8' lights. Should still be plent bright.
Ended up being just over $11,880.00 Still have a lot more to do like storage, tools etc...
That's a lot of shop for 12 large. Congrats! Now you gotta work on buzzing neon budweiser signs and a couple of shop stools! I knew a guy who had a urinal put in his shop/man cave.
Probably should've mentioned that before the build huh....
Forgot to mention a couple of ideas that I want to one day incorporate into my own shop:
1. Try to get your compressor into your loft for noise isolation.
2. Try to get your dust collector up there too. Not necessarily it's holding bin, but if you can locate the motor up top, and create a lil bin downstaris for easy cleaning, it will also save you the headache of all that noise.
I have most of the insulation in now. I lack about 35 feet of 23" insulation in the ceiling.
All the electric is roughed in except the main from the house to the shop. I have to get a track hoe in there for that.
Electric is on in the shop. Found some plans for an air filtration set up that uses a 110v squirrell cage and household air filters. I'm going to put it between ceiling joists so it doesn't hang down.
Got one wall and the ceiling paneled with OSB. It's starting to look like a shop now!
Soundin good Jim!!
We do require pics when complete!
I will say this: barn style roof costs extra. Each "rafter" is actually 3 rafters, joined together at the ridge, the pitch-change, and the projection. You're paying for the storage space it will give you...otherwise, go for straight gables and sacrifice some storage space.
It's already built. I like the extra headspace the gabled roof gives.
cool ... what did you end up paying?
Just under 12K but I'm still adding things so...
Here's some pics:
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1355.jpg) the electric trench
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1347.jpg) before insulation and plywood
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1357.jpg)
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v42/keyman/CIMG1365.jpg) The inspector. I think he thinks it's his new dog house.
Thats awesome Jim. Your going to have a lot of fun out there.
Nice shop there Jim. I would live in that thing if I had it.
Thank you all. I'm really having fun getting it ready.
Ohhh yeah!!
If you paint it white before you move in, you'll thank yourself later!!
I also used 7/16" OSB for my interior shop walls and ceilings, I used a good primer and white paint. I later installed a divider wall and door and used white "kilz" paint and it also worked great with much less time and labor. I bought some 5/8" plywood with one side melamine for my "glue up" benches, I cover them with contractors paper and use butchers paper where I glue the bow lams. your shop is looking great! (http://i596.photobucket.com/albums/tt46/Robertfishes/emptybuildbench.jpg)
I used Kilz on the outside, might as well use it on the inside too.
I used 1/4" staples to hang the OSB. It holds great. I bought a box of 5000 so I didn't spare any.
What is melamine?
Melamine plywood is used in cabinets, The owner of the Cabinet shop by my house said "it's a thermo plastic product baked under pressure onto plywood". I got it from the shop for a very very nice price..I don't have any air tools so I used drywall screws for the OSB, didn't have any help either.
That would be a monumental task Robert (as you are aware)! I tried to hang a 2' x 4' piece on the ceiling and had a very tough time doing it! I made a long "T" out of 1x4 to help hold it up while I squared it and secured it.
thats what I did but I used 2x4s, I also used an 8 ft ladder with a couple of 2x4 scraps on top..this worked well for me.
The ladder idea is great!
That really turned out nice Jim!
We finally got a concrete guy out to get going on ours. He got it formed up yesterday. Of course they're calling for rain all week now. Arrrrgghhh!
Finished putting all the plywood up on the walls and ceiling today.
Going to add two more T8 lights for a total of 6 8 footers in a 400 square ft. shop. I have some 4ft lights that I can put over work areas also.
Once I get it painted white inside it should be plenty bright.
You're sometimes limited when you go to a home center, but the lamps with the higher color temperature number (eg. 4,100 or 5,000K) the better the color reproduction and closer to daylight you are. We use the 5000K lamps in the printing biz. The wattage can be the same but the higher kelvin number will look brighter. Keep a couple of clamp lamps with incandescent bulbs for chasing rings on selfbows though. ;)
Sounds good thanks.
I shot six gallons of Kilz on the walls and ceiling today. I took the bulbs down to avoid overspray. It should look brighter in there now!
I picked up a Craftsman table saw for $30.00 today off of Craigslist. It will be enough to build my work bench and cabinets.
Wow! Here I am just insulating and sheet rocking my garage and installing a workbench down one side and getting excited about that! haha
What would you guys say is the best height for a wall mounted work bench?
I like top 34-35" off the ground for general workbench work.
There is a tip I heard a while back. If you stand up straight with your hands at you sides, your wrist will be at the ideal workbench height for you. For me that is 34.5" off the ground.
34" to the top is standard, but in my dad's shop, we made one bench a few inches higher, so you aren't bending over so much. It's good for chopsaw and layout work. It's amazing how a few inches can save your back.
P.S. My concrete guy is coming back tomorrow to finish the ramp and the pad outside the man door. I got 3 walls up and my nail gun trigger valve sprung a leak. Got to go pick up a $30 trigger valve assembly because of a .10 cent urethane seal. :mad:
I made my work bench high enough so I don't have to bend over at all to work on a stave.
My work bench top is 42" tall, my vise jaws are 51" above the floor.
Cuz is over 6' tall so this gives you an idea of how comfortable it is to work on a bow with my extra work bench height.
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v181/ekrewson/bowbee1-1.jpg)