Hey everybody,
I'm new to bow hunting and this forum. I've been reading past posts and guys talk about aiming down the arrow. If I line up my point with the target I hit way to the left. I guess my question is there a way to aim. So far I just kind of eyeball it and I see my shooting getting better. When I'm shooting good probably 6 arrows in a six inch circle at 17 yards. When my shootings bad I realize now it's because of my release or form.
I'm getting pretty hooked on it, I've rifle hunted a lot and I've gotten to where I'll just tune up some hand loads, shoot some good groups and then my rifle sits there until I need to kill something. And then I picked up a friends tricked out bowteck and stuck a couple of arrows right in the bull at 20 yrds, and decided that things just a cable gun. But with this I can tell I'll need a bunch of practice to really be competent.
Just for information, I've got a 65 lb Wes Wallace stealth take down. My draw is 29 inches, I anchor my thumb knuckle in my back molar, and I'm shooting 30 inch gold tip traditional's 5575's. They seem to be hitting the target straight.
Anyhow I've learned a lot just reading the past posts and would sure appreciate any help.
John
John,
My suggestions would be to first make sure your form is CONSISTANT and can be executed instinctively to the point you are not analizing it and working on it as you are learning to aim.
2nd. make sure your equipment is tuned as good as you can with either the bareshaft tuning method, paper tuning or broadhead tuning to help eliminate the effects that your equipment can have on your inacccuracy.
3rd. find out if you are right or left eye dominant.
4th. research the different aiming techiniques so you can make a more educated decision on what aiming techinique may be better to suit your needs, personality and ability.
Ray ;)
I would suggest you try NOT aiming.
Pick a spot the size of a flea that you want to hit, draw anchor and release. You don't aim a baseball when you throw it, why aim an arrow?
This is what's called instinctive shooting and once you get the hang of it, you'll make shots subconciously (sp).
Your eye will be aware of the arrows direction and will make it's own adjustment. Like riding a bicycle. Once you get going your mind makes the adjustments without your concious thought.
Just POINT.....and SHOOT!!!!! :bigsmyl:
the arrow aims itself... I look, pick, lift, draw, anchor & loose.....
Arrows seldom 'point' at the intended target. Your hand should always 'point' at the target.
Do what Biggie and others suggest.
"Burn a hole" in what you want to hit...and let her fly. :thumbsup: :goldtooth:
Black wolf nailed it!!
Do some more research on aiming methods basically there's gap or 2nd vision which commonly gets confused with point of aim which use's you arrow tip as a site pin and then there's also instinctive which is a learned ability same as the rest of the instinctive things like throwing a ball
I started with the burn a hole method of instinctive and IMHO the gap or split vision method will get you to the same place faster.In the end both styles become basically the same thing
Good luck feel free to PM me if ya have any ???s
You may want to take a look at "Become the Arrow" by Byron Ferguson. Also, the "Masters of the Barebow" DVD would be helpful. Check out Rod Jenkins' section. Another good one if you can find it is "Instinctive Indirect Aiming" by Bob Wesley.
Hope that helps,
TM
I shoot like Biggie, and it works for me. Give it a try, many people dont want to see the arrow at all when they shoot, me being one of them...
Thanks for the response !
I'm not familiar with some of the terminology but I'll research it. I guess what I'm doing is the instinctive aiming. I draw focus on the target hold for a couple of seconds and shoot. I haven't done the arrow tuning yet, just relied on the advice of the guy selling me the arrows. What is the simple list method ? Remember I'm simple minded.
John
What they are saying is that your whole life you have thrown balls, rocks ect. At first you may not have hit close to your target. Instictive archery is just that.... Muscle/brain/hand eye memory. Use good form and do NOT pay any attention to the arrow. Your brain will make the corrections to get the arrow where it needs to be. When you get this right it is effortless.
John III
QuoteOriginally posted by Muskoxman:
What is the simple list method ?
John
The most simplistic aiming method is Instinctive Aiming in regards to how it is executed. It's basically just point and shoot...but it is generally harder to master to become consistantly accurate with it...especially when an archer tries to become accurate at longer distances or as the targets get smaller.
Instinctive Aiming has it's advantages in many hunting situations where the bowhunter has only a split second to make the shot, when shooting moving targets or when the bowhunter has to be in an awkward position to make the shot.
IMO, it takes an exceptional archer with a God given gift of exceptional hand and eye coordination and a passion to develop it to make Instinctive Aiming work as accurately and consistantly in many target competition situations as some of the other aiming techiniques that are available to learn.
If you research the high level archery competitions you will notice that the majority of top shooters use some other aiming techinique besides Instinctive Aiming.
Where you will see Instinctive Aiming being competitive is in most 3D shoots where the target distances are placed between 5 and 30yrds, which are typical hunting shots. The reason why it's more competitive there is because the targets are closer and the scoring rings are larger.
Use whatever aiming techinique that seems to suit your goals, personality and ability. There's really no right or wrong way to aim a bow. Just use whatever works for you.
I for example...love to shoot any target no matter the distance. I like to BOTH hunt and compete...so I have learned 3 different aiming techiniques so I can apply the aiming system that will have the biggest advantage in a specific situation. My primary aiming techinique is Gap but I can also use Point of Aim and Instinctive Aiming when I feel I need to.
Ray ;)
make sure of your eye dominance then do everything else, learned this one the hard way
You must be either very strong or very young if you are drawing a 65# bow to 30 inches and holding it for a couple seconds. Holding for me brings no advantage. I hit my anchor (very important) and let it go. 55# will kill anything in North America and will allow you to shoot a bow much longer and probably more accurately. Good luck and enjoy the process.
I've got a question, I'm right eyed dominant and right handed. I shoot my bow with both eyes open. Should I be closing my left eye ? I was looking for the simplest way for arrow tuning, not the simple list. Spell check screwed me up. I know 65# bow is plenty heavy. I guess I was thinking if I was going to stick a big old moose or a grizzly I'd want plenty of bow. I have no problem drawing it and holding. As a farmer I've pretty much spent my life doing manual labor. When I got it (less than a month ago) I tried to shoot for a hour, of course my shooting just got worse because of fatigue. So I started with shorter sessions and working my way up. Getting better all the time. I shoot for about a half hour now.
My main goal is to be competent out to 30 yds I don't think I'd try a shot over that for now, and surely not a moving target. Like I said I've only been shooting arrows less than a month.
Thanks, John
leave both eyes open.....
arrow tuning can be done many ways,,,bare shaft,paper, Flight ( shoot long and see how it flies ). I use mostly flight tuning & paper tune, My arrows come out of paradox about 5 yards ( going by paper tear & sight ). I found & agree with others that bare shaft is better done with wheelie bows & the use of carbon arrows with trad bows.
May I suggest a closer goal first that you will achieve.Yea we all all want to be good out to 30 or more but genrally speaking that doesn't happen overnite.Make your goals achievable then when you reach it raise it.
The best shots seem to advocate blank bail shooting from very close with NO TARGET to work on "their" shot.It's boring but it does work well.By "best shots" I'm talkin top guys that have proven themselves more than just on the keyboard
Good luck
I have used a type of bareshaft tuning and it is great for getting you close without having to be a good shot or have great form (works for everyone).
First set the brace height to what is recomended for your bow, set nock hight to 4/8 or 5/8" and make sure your nocks fit the string (not to tight). The brace height and nock height can be fin tuned later.
Now, get a target with a consistent medium such as a layered block target or foam target that is not shot up. Stand 5 to 10 yds away and shoot into the target. If your arrows stick into the target sideways with the nock to the left (for a right hand shooter) your arrows are too week. if they are nock to the right your arrows are too stiff. when they are close they will drive into the target straight.
Lower point wt or shorten shaft to stiffen, add point wt or shoot longet shaft to weaken.
You can also print out OL Adcock's tuning method and use that (www.bowmaker.net/tuning.htm).
Masters of the Barebow 1 and 2 are great videos. They give many different tips, and show many different ways of aiming. Good Luck, Steve
I guess what I was wondering is, what is the relation of my dominant eye to my shooting ?
Thanks for the help, I am defiantly going to start small and work my way up.
Rt handed shooter "should" be rt eye dom
I never knew that myself till many many yrs later and since my eye's are so close and I can force the switch(I'm lft eye rt handed) which has become habit, I didn't buy all new stuff and relearn.
Hey John,
You mentioned in the original post that when you are shooting good, you shoot 6 arrows in a six inch circle at 17 yards. You also mentioned that your arrows fly good.
Seems to me you have a great start!! MY ADVICE? Keep it simple!!!
Your stated goal is a good one. To become proficient out to 30 yards for hunting. Sounds like you are shooting instinctive (not aiming, just picking a spot and shooting). IMO that's the way to go for hunting, ESPECIALLY in Alaska. I doubt there is any other place as diverse as Alaska.
Should you ever have the opportunity to stick a charging black bear, a full curl ram while laying flat on your belly on a rock outcropping, swing shoot a bull moose that bolts upon realizing you arent a hot cow, or a fox moving past a small opening in the brush, you'll be glad you are an instinctive traditional archer.
Alaska offers some of the best stump shooting. Anywhere you find old growth spruce, youll find nice soft, mossy stumps to kill. The quickest way to become proficient is to take to the woods and shoot from stump to stump, one arrow at a time. Shoot through brush, around trees, under spruce bows, from your knees, sitting down, standing on a dead fall. Doesnt matter what distances, who cares! Have fun!
Before you know it, you'll be hitting what you look at. You'll know how far out there you begin to have trouble. You'll then know your maximim effective range when you see it.
If you find along the way that you are having specific trouble with arrow flight, etc, THEN ask questions.
I started out shooting heavier than 65#. If it feels good, do it. Im a snap shooter. I pick a spot, draw, and release the second I hit anchor. It's just MY opinion, but I believe in shooting a weight that almost requires one to release immediately upon hitting anchor. Why? because then you dont have time to think. The more I think, the worse I shoot. If I stand squared off in front of a target, I think. If I shoot more than one arrow from any given spot or distance, I think. Im thinking about putting the arrow in the same place as the last instead of picking a unique spot that has my total attention and focus.
That is what hunting situations are. Unique. So it only makes sense that we would practice in the same way. If a moose walked up broadside at 20 yards and stood there until we scratched ourself and got all lined up, it wouldnt be much fun!!
As mentioned, instinctive shooters seem to do best in 3D competition. I just disagree (with all due respect) with the stated reason. The reason we do well is because we are shooting at unidentified ranges. Doesnt matter if they are closer or larger!!!!!! They are put out in hunting type situations, with all the brain distractions we are used to seeing and are used by the brain to judge the shot.
We beat compounders who are shooting twice the speeds we are. They have stabalizers and peep sights. But, they are handicapped because they must judge distance. We dont. We have a built in range finder.
Some say instinctive takes longer to master than gap shooting or string walking. Thats a curious thing. To know this as fact, one would have to have accomplished both, each learned without benefit of the experience gained by the prior. That isnt possible.
Remember, we ARE talking about bowhunting. To use the conscious mind to learn to gap shoot or one of the other aiming techniques, to me is limiting. When I think of ALL the amazing things the unconscious mind handles, every second of every day, processing information and sending signals to the muscles, it blows me away. Compare that to what the conscious mind is capable of and there just is NO comparison. It only makes logical sense to allow the unconscious mind every opportunity to take charge of my shooting.
My feeble brain can manage to remember my bow, quiver of arrows, and shooting glove. Beyond that.... PICK A SPOT... PICK A SPOT... PICK A SPOT!!!
Thats my eighty five and a half cents. Sorry, Im eighty three and a half cents over the limit!!!
For what it is worth: I started shooting a recurve when I was a kid. I stopped (for a long time) and recently started again. I know I have good equipment - but - initially couldn't get the results I wanted. In looking for answers I found out about gap shooting (Masters of the Barebow 1 & 2 from 3 Rivers) - for me - that was the answer. You mentioned that you are shooting your hunting bow - I started learning to shoot with a lighter draw weight - so I could focus on the process - before spending much time working with my hunting bow. The following image is my personal best at 20 yards using a 35# Tamerlane. Even though I haven't been able to duplicate that group (never mind the Robin Hood) - this one group does establish what can be done - and sets the goal everytime I shoot. One final thought - as I consider myself a hunter - every shot is the "first shot".
(http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm149/JDicello/JimsStuff/TamerlaneRH.jpg)
Ray,
With all due respect, I couldnt care less about shooting competition and I see no reason to compare the best with the best.
I also see no reason to debate this with you because we are talking apples and oranges here.
Im a bowhunter, and if Im not mistaken, this is a bowhunting site. More often than not, the folks here that promote aiming systems are those who ARE interested in shooting proficiently at targets and in competition shooting.
I know you are into research and I respect that. I know you have taught archery to newbies and I respect that as well. But, because you have found that newbies are quicker to shoot a group at a target with an aiming systme, says nothing about their ability in the woods for bowhunting and thats what Im talking about, and again, I do believe that is what this site is about.
I have taught a great many new to trad archery, too. Ive learned more than Ive taught really. And what I have learned over and over again is that aside from the very basics, they are better served left to their own devices to find what works for them. And if it's made fun, and not confused and filled with statistics and do's and dont's and what the best do and all that, they will find their own groove.
I show them what works for me, you show them what works for you, and chances are they will end up finding their own way.And that my friend is what it's all about.
My hat is off to those who enjoy competition. MY competition is with myself and with the game I pursue. And, with my good friends a littel healthy competition taking turns picking a spot on stumps is the best practice in the world.
To me, trad archery is a very personal thing. Im passionate about it. I couldnt let pride or competition be the driving factor. My driving factor is the love of the bow and the beauty of the flight of an arrow hitting it's mark. Just one. That one single arrow all by itself sticking in a spot on a stump or a tuft of hair behing the shoulder.
What I love to pass along is the joy of being out in God's creation. I love the feeling of being so small and insignificant, relevant to the enormity of God's amazing work of art.
Ive seen unimaginable pain and suffering in my life and thirty minutes in the woods or mountians with a stick and an arrow is worth more than thirty years of anything the man-made world has to offer. Thats traditional bowhunting for me. Beating another human being or the animal even, means little really. It's the unique ability that nature has of cleansing the soul.
Just a walk in these amazing places should be, but isnt enough. Men have a need for challenge and a need to conquer. Bringing that out from deep inside, archery fills that need for me. But, from "inside" is the key.
So much of what we do in life is about external gratification. In our capitalistic society we must strive to survive. Some folks need more. Im one who has a deep need to escape man's trappings for a satisfaction that is only found in being alone and as far from the manufactured plastic world as possible.
OOPS!! I hit the reply button by accident. Good a place as any to stop my rambling I guess. Its an interesting process to formulate things into words that you dont ever remember consciously even thinking about before. Had I proofread, I would have taken much out Im sure. I always do. Cant help it. I just appreciate a place like this to share my thoughts... for what they're worth. Thanks!!
Jdice,
Awesome shooting. Its great you made it back to trad shooting and found your answers. Thats what matters.
As far as the rest of my rantings...
I sure hope that I dont sound like i have any answers. I, like everyone else, have opinions and what works for me. Some of them strongly held. But I certainly wouldnt suggest that my way is the only or best way. Ive been thru my share of frustration and seen others go thru it. I will always be one that promotes keeping it simple. If it aint fun, it's hardly worth doing and the end result is important for sure, but the process is where we learn and grow and spend our lives. Enjoy the process.
I hope that where we all come from is a place of wanting to share the joy of bowhunting with others. So many here are wanting and willing to help others toward that end. It's a thing worth sharing.
I have to stop an aweful lot and look at myself and ask what my own motives are. Pride is a sneaky bugger.
Im just a guy who loves to hunt and fish and take every opportunity to talk about it. A long winded one at that!!!
Randall,
The ONLY reason why I bring up competition is to show a comparision of the different aiming techiniques in an area where there is an actual way to measure the results in regards to precision accuracy.
You gave some awesome advice in regards to how to practice for hunting situations...which I totally support and I personally do...when I'm preparing to hunt.
In competition there is a target and in bowhunting there is a target. The biggest difference in bowhunting is it's the first shot that really counts and there usually isn't a second chance for another shot. In target competition...there's multiple arrows being shot. I personally view every shot as my first shot. At least that's how I am able to focus on each shot without the previous or future shots distracting me.
IMO, Instinctive Aiming isn't the only effective way or only traditional way to aim a trad bow while bowhunting, which is why I try to go into detail about all the different aiming techiniques when they are being discussed.
I'm one of the bigest supporters of Instinctive Aiming...I just try to be as open and honest about it based on my experience and research so that anyone looking to get into this sport or change their aiming techinique has some realistic information to go by.
Nothing more...nothing less.
We really are alot alike in our passion for this great sport. The only difference is that I seem to have a little more experience in target competition than you do...but that doesn't make me any better of an archer or a better teacher than you.
Ray ;)
"We beat compounders who are shooting twice the speeds we are. They have stabalizers and peep sights. But, they are handicapped because they must judge distance. We dont. We have a built in range finder."
"With all due respect, I couldnt care less about shooting competition and I see no reason to compare the best with the best."
It would take a real good stick shooter to beat a so so wheel shooter all else being equal not that it really should matter to anybody but you did make the comparison
I spent a doz. or more yrs getting so so with the burn a hole method....personally "I" would have done better IMHO if I had used what was right there.Now that I can see my arrow not that I look at it LOL I can't help but see it.I can now understand the why of folks saying they can't/don't see their arrow AND I understand the folks that say how can you not because I have personally gone down both roads.
Now it's been over 20 yrs and I must say the journey has been enjoyable even the struggling yrs that really didn't need to be there.
This thread is/was about "aiming" and there's good AND bad points to all of the ways we aim but without knowing all of them how can we decide whats best for us??
YES choice's are personal....I like to know what my choice's are before choosing
Stmpthmpr,
It sounds like we understand each other. I just want to become a good bow hunter . It seems like all the time here in AK I here about more archery only hunts, and of course there's the dalton highway. I'm no spring chicken and having grown up in the sticks I've done my share of hunting, but with a rifle or pistol. I do enjoy getting up to archery range before taking a shot. I'm kind of a one shot one kill guy.
If your not to far away and wouldn't mind seeing me fling arrows I could use some help. Plus you might want to get a look at my herd of muskox.
Thanks, John
Good post Swampbuck.
I only made the point because I had a stupid emotional reaction when it was said that Instinctive archers only do well in 3D tourneys because the ranges are short and the targets are bigger. May be the case for some but not all.
In my admittedly limited experience at 3D shoots, my buddies and I have done very well and I believe it is because the comp shooters are used to shooting groups at known distances. I am what I am, and dont know enough about others to judge whether they are so-so or great. Youre right... doesnt matter.
All I originally wanted to do is respond to the original post and encourage him. I didnt look for how I could bless him with my brilliance, I looked at what he said. He has been shooting some good groups. He isnt consistant yet. It takes time.
My apologies for responding to what I consider to be generalizations. My opinions were as well. Good call.
When I started out I was alone. Didnt know any other trads and internet didnt exist. I found my own way and for much of that had the benefit of a lifestyle that allowed me to shoot hundreds of arrows a day. Building them, shooting them, hunting, was my lifestyle. Thats where Im coming from. I really should just learn to shut up. This online thing is new to me and the chance to talk about what I love is very cool. I just need to stick to what I know. Targets and competition aint it!!!
How'd I get wound so tight today?? I need to go string up to get unstrung!!
QuoteOriginally posted by Muskoxman:
Stmpthmpr,
It sounds like we understand each other. I just want to become a good bow hunter . It seems like all the time here in AK I here about more archery only hunts, and of course there's the dalton highway. I'm no spring chicken and having grown up in the sticks I've done my share of hunting, but with a rifle or pistol. I do enjoy getting up to archery range before taking a shot. I'm kind of a one shot one kill guy.
If your not to far away and wouldn't mind seeing me fling arrows I could use some help. Plus you might want to get a look at my herd of muskox.
Thanks, John
Dont know how much help I can be John, but I can sure help you pass some time shooting point sticks and stuff!!!
I never turn down the op to shoot with someone. Ill shoot you an email and see where you're at.
Randy
Have FUN guys sounds like a blast
Hey randy,
shot you back an email.
John
Got it John!
Ill be in touch!
The things we learn from others. Kind of like this site. :coffee:
I've got another question, do some of you shoot better at a 3-d target than a 2-d, flat target ? The other day I shot a squirrel in my barn, hit it no problem. Then today I hung a 12 oz plastic juice jug in front of my target, and I shot a lot better. Maybe my eye's are just goofy and focus on the 3-d better.
John
Our minds can be stimulated by different things that can definitely effect our shooting...which is why some archers are better at shooting certain targets than others.
One of the reasons why you might shoot better is because you are either focusing in on a smaller target or you're more excited about shooting a 3 dimensional target.
Whatever the reason...the mind can be trained to shoot just as accurately at a 2 dimensional target as it can a 3 dimensional target.
Ray ;)
When I started learning to shoot with a barebow - my 1st target was a 24" bag. After some effort, I was able to hit the target out to 40 yards consistently - but - I couldn't shoot a tight group at any distance. Then I was given an 18" target - almost immediately - I was able to hit the 18" target, consistently, out to 40 yards - but - I still couldn't get a consistent group on the target.
One day I realized that I was aiming at the target - the entire target - not a single spot on the target. In other words, my accuracy improved because my mental target got smaller when I got the smaller target. So I started shooting at a single spot on the target. Almost that same day - my consistent accuracy started improving.
I am suggesting that maybe you are doing the same thing I was doing - you might be aiming at your target - not a spot on the target. Given that a squirrel and a milk jug are probably smaller than your regular target - your accuracy suddenly appears much better than when shooting at the bigger target.
Bottom line - assuming you have tuned equipment and a reasonable form - your mind becomes the most important component in your accuracy. Per a line I heard in a movie - "Aim small, miss small".
On game I like to pick a "real" spot like fat wrinkle's.It helped me out quite a bit.On 3D foam targets there are old holes your buddies nock ect. but real spots just the same.
Good luck
You guys were right, big target bad.
I don't know if it's because of my scotch blood or be raised by parents that grew up in the depression, but I have a hard time spending the greenbacks. When I do part with a few I believe in buying quality. Anyhow being a hay farmer I was using hay bales for a target. I soon figured out I was going to mess up my fletching. So I draped an old holifill sleeping bag over the bales and drew a target on it. Worked good, stopped the arrows good, of course the sleeping bag is now tore all to hell. Made a target this mourning out of a old saddle blanket and sewed a piece of black belting to it for a target. To make a long story short, shooting much better.
John
why would the eye dominance make a differnce you shoot with both eyes open any way
Hey Good old boy,
I guess thats really what I was asking. What difference does it make if you're keeping both eyes open anyhow?
John
Keeping both eyes open helps in depth perception.
Having your dominant eye directly over the top of the arrow while aiming makes it easier for the brain to see and adjust windage.
Ray ;)
Actually doing a simple test to check eye dominance can help with understanding it's importance.
Put your hands out flat with your fingers together and your thumbs out at right angles to your hands. Now slide hands together, fingers over fingers and thumb over thumb until you have a small triangular shaped hole the size of a broadhead. Now pick a tiny spot in the distance as you would for a bow shot and with your arms stretched straight out, QUICKLY raise your "sight window to see the spot through the hole in your hands. Now draw your hands back to your face,keeping the spot in sight until your hands reach an eye. The eye thats looking through the hole is the dominant one.
I dont pretend to know how the brain sends signals to the muscles that cause you to raise your hands to your dominant eye every time, but it does make a whole lot of sense that we wouldnt want to draw a string up to the eye that doesnt have that direct connection to that mechanism.
A friend of mine learned about eye dominance after years of shooting. His brain made the adjustment and he is a decent shot. But starting out, the road to consistantly accurate shooting must be a much shorter one when hand and eye are in sinc.
I personally never bought the idea of instinctive shooting being better.
It doesn't take any longer to gap shoot and its certainly more effective. The only time its not is in very low light situations or on running game.
IMHO there are alot of people who use instinctive shooting as an excuse for poor accuracy.
They say "I don't need to shoot at 20yds. This is better for hunting" and to me that is a lil too much like those guys at the rifle range with gut shots and laugh without being bothered and say "I'm not much on the range but I wear them out on the field!"
yeah I don't think so. If you can drive tacks with both methods at 15 yds but with one method you can do it at 25yds too I think that is a better aiming system personally.
Done correctly gap style shooting is as fast as instinctive shooting. The only advantage I see to instinctive is on running game which you shouldn't be taking shots at unless they are at can't miss distances anyway so I really don't see why so many people are enamored with instinctive shooting.
just my .02
Are there guys that can drive tacks (not literally of course) out to 30yds with instinctive shooting? No doubt. There sure are. But for every one of them I'd say there are 100 that have 6in groups at 15yds and couldn't hit running game anyway. Not every gap shooter is rod jenkins or larry yien but I do think with a visual marker to use 90% if the people can tighten their groups.
i used to hunt opposite handed of eye dominance and when I switched over to where i was supposed to be everything just clicked into place. of course this back in the wheelie days...
hmmmm.... Ok, been shooting for 6 years now. I shoot decent, can generally hit a coke bottle to 30 yards the vast majority of times. But, I am in no way satisfied with this. I used to shoot 4" groups with a compound at 40+ yards, with a peep. I have always wanted my 25 and under shots (like all of us) to be very consistent with the barebow. But, never have been able to do it.
ANYWAY. I just held my hands out like it was said. I focused on a dot in the distance and closed my left eye. i no longer could see the spot. I closed my right eye, and there it is in the middle of the sight window. What the heck? Does this mean I am left eye dominant, have always been? Since I am right handed, how should I apply this information to better shooting? Thanks, Dan
There are many many excellent sources today regarding Instinctive shooting, in book and DVD. For the beginner though.. I would highly recommend Brian Sorrell's, "Beginner's Guide to Traditional Archery". Read it, and follow the practice exercises exactly as written.
Hey Guys, after reading up on gap shooting I realized thats what I'm doing (remember I'm a newbie). I draw back to my anchor point hold for a couple of seconds while my eyes kinda do this split vision thing and then release. Any advice on gap shooting would be appreciated. I wasn't really blessed with excellent hand to eye coordination. I have a simpler test for dominant eye, just hold your fist out at arms length with your thumb up, with both eyes open line your thumb up with an stationary object close one eye after another, the eye your thumb doesn't move for is dominant.
Hey I'm getting better, another crazy thing is I've gotten taller. I've got kind of a crooked back, not like a hunch back but my right shoulder sits lower than my left. My fiend came over the other day who's about my same height and I seemed taller than him. Sure enough I've gained a quarter of an inch ! Pulling this bow is straiting me out, another use for a stick bow, back straightener !
Thanks, John
The best thing my wife did for me, I might add without me knowing it, she took photos of me while I was shooting, it showed me the inconsistency on some shots, it was a big help.
Now some on here have said had someone take a video, I think that would be better, although the photos in my case did reveal what I need to do to have better form.
Consistency in your form is the best thing you can do for yourself.
Master of the longbow I , Rick Welsch instructional hunting shooting DVD, is another great one. Rick Welsch is more back to the fundamentals and the basics, and that's where it's all at, doing the same thing over and over consistently
Carl
Hey Carl,
Ya I really can feel it when my form is right and thats when my shooting gets better. I ordered that DVD and a cricket clicker. I notice when I really flex my back and get to the end of my draw is when I shoot good.
Thanks,
John
For the longest time I've been telling people I had a 29" draw, but since my wife took the photos, I don't think so, I could very well be at 28" but years ago with wheels I was 29". I also find that if I relax, and get into concentrating heavily on one-shot it is so much better. Other than that you're just flinging arrows.
But I do like the simplicity of Rick Welsch, commonsense archery.
Carl
I was personally relieved on the Master of the BB DVD when larry yien who is a champion gap shooter said he shoots opposite hand of his dominant eye just like I do. He said "So I squint". And that made me feel a whole lot better.
I don't see what the big deal is. Granted I don't shoot over my dominant eye so I also don't know what I'm missing by shooting like that.
But by simply squinting I can either see the arrow or "see through" the arrow (its still there, and in focus, but I can see cleanly through it like glass) when I want to shoot at a larger distance. I can stack easily.
Muskox: you asked for tips. I'm new too but some things that helped me are:
1) "keep your shoulder down". If you raise your bow arms shoulder it will change your point of impact but not look different in your vision. They say to practice form for that by pushing against a door frame.
2)"aim with your shoulders in alignment." look at that clock with the archer in it they show around here. Proper form is more important than aiming. I didn't understand what they meant until I really studied that clock and analyzed why my shots were going left or right regardless of how I changed my foot stances from open, closed, or even.
Other than memorizing your gaps and keeping your bow arm stiff, practicing clean release and all the other basics those two tips were what was really giving me inconsistent accuracy. I had a low poundage bow, numerous anchor points coming natural to me. And really good accuracy.
Except for the random shot in perfect alignment just 12 inches low for some unknown reason. (raising shoulder during draw). And the random shot 6 inches left or right of my intended target. (bad form, shoulders out of alignment)
Both of those were very frustrating because I didn't see- or perhaps remember- them in the videos and the arrow looked straight in my view. I had my gap right, Numerous bone oriented anchor points, but the shoots weren't going right. And those were why. Hope it helps.
:wavey:
:archer:
This is ONLY for communicative purposes so we can all be somewhat on the same page or better understand what is going on while we aim.
Everyone aims a bow and arrow if they are pointing it at something and trying to hit. Look up the word 'aim' and it should explain it and define it.
There's just different ways to do aim...and when an archer aims Instinctively...their not consciously analizing it to the point they exactly know where the arrow point or any other reference they maybe using in relationship to the target needs to be.
The aiming primarily happens within the subconscious.
Ray ;)