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Main Boards => PowWow => Topic started by: Ron LaClair on May 17, 2017, 12:54:00 PM

Title: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 17, 2017, 12:54:00 PM
It was found in S W Utah many years ago and I've had it for at least 20 years. When I first got it I didn't know if it was animal or human so I took it to Michigan State University museum to have them tell me what it was.

Turns out it is a hip bone of a bison calf. They took me to the "Bone Room" on the 3rd floor where they have isles and isles of file drawers of bones from all animals. The adult bone they had was huge compared to the bone that I have so obviously it's from a calf

    (http://***********.bowsite.com/TF/pics/00small32399552.JPG)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: kevsuperg on May 17, 2017, 12:57:00 PM
Now that's cool.  Any idea on how old that may be?
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 17, 2017, 12:58:00 PM
The point just barely protrudes out the other side. They estimated it to be at least 200 years old.

   (http://tradgang.com/ron/ron31.jpg)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: DanielB89 on May 17, 2017, 01:09:00 PM
have a pic of the whole thing?  That's absolutely amazing!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: fnshtr on May 17, 2017, 01:13:00 PM
WOW! That is some pretty good penetration.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: kevsuperg on May 17, 2017, 02:21:00 PM
Wow early 1800s, I can play out so many scenarios in my mind.
You were probably the first to touch that point since it was let go.
Just awesome.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: old_goat2 on May 17, 2017, 02:25:00 PM
My brother in-law has a vertebra with a flint head in it, super neat stuff!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 17, 2017, 02:41:00 PM
At one time I checked on the style of the points of that area and it matched.

(http://tradgang.com/ron/ron29.jpg)

   (http://tradgang.com/ron/ron30.jpg)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Keith Zimmerman on May 17, 2017, 04:44:00 PM
That's cool!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Gordon Jabben on May 17, 2017, 04:48:00 PM
:thumbsup:
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Jon Stewart on May 17, 2017, 05:53:00 PM
That's about as good as it gets as far as artifacts are concern. great find.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Warden609 on May 17, 2017, 05:54:00 PM
What a cool piece of history.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Pine on May 17, 2017, 05:57:00 PM
Way cool , thanks for sharing .
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Roy from Pa on May 17, 2017, 06:12:00 PM
Awesome, Ron..
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: kleine on May 17, 2017, 06:26:00 PM
That's cool Ron!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: RAU on May 17, 2017, 06:36:00 PM
That's incredible!!  What a find!!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: dresnor on May 17, 2017, 07:19:00 PM
Awesome piece!

Thank you very much for sharing.

Jeremy
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Tedd on May 17, 2017, 07:38:00 PM
Thats a cool thing to have. Nice!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: TooManyHobbies on May 17, 2017, 07:38:00 PM
I don't see any knife/scrape marks from removing meat, to confirm if it was a lethal hit. I wonder if it provided food for man...or beast. Very cool. Thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: mahantango on May 17, 2017, 11:08:00 PM
That is one of the coolest things I've seen in a long time! Total reality check on what "primitive" bows and heads are capable of.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: IdahoCurt on May 17, 2017, 11:25:00 PM
Wow,that's cool! thanks for sharing.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: elkken on May 18, 2017, 12:05:00 AM
Definitely has the WOW factor .... very nice Ron
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Jon Stewart on May 18, 2017, 07:09:00 AM
Looking at how thick the base is on that point makes me wonder if that wasn't on an atlatl dart versus an arrow shaft.

Again, great find.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: cacciatore on May 18, 2017, 07:34:00 AM
Fantastic find. So cool for us traditionals.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: twitchstick on May 18, 2017, 08:12:00 AM
Wow pretty neat find! DO you know what part of SW Utah it was found? Not for a treasure hunt but just curious because I live in SW Utah.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 18, 2017, 10:35:00 AM
Here's another picture to better show the size of the point. It should confirm it's an arrow point

  (http://***********.bowsite.com/tf/pics/00small53728318.JPG)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: DanielB89 on May 18, 2017, 10:36:00 AM
wow!!!!

I find it cool that the bone wasn't cracked any!  

Ron, do you have a facebook?  I would love to share this so others could see!  We have a tons of arrow heads and such around here.  I don't know of anyone that has seen anything like this.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 18, 2017, 10:36:00 AM
The hip socket

  (http://***********.bowsite.com/tf/pics/00small20096287.JPG)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: DesertDude on May 18, 2017, 10:46:00 AM
super cool
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 18, 2017, 11:51:00 AM
1" wide

  (http://***********.bowsite.com/tf/pics/00small17142776.JPG)
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: on May 18, 2017, 11:56:00 AM
Yep! That's cool!

Bisch
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: KSCATTRAPR on May 18, 2017, 12:35:00 PM
A once in a lifetime piece right there, awesome!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Bud B. on May 18, 2017, 12:38:00 PM
Very awesome!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: on May 18, 2017, 12:45:00 PM
What amazes me is how much penetration it got, yet it is a thick piece of flint. The shape and the edge with enough power behind it, the First Nation people were not playing with toys.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: KyStickbow on May 18, 2017, 12:48:00 PM
Thats's pretty awesome Ron!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Bill from NJ on May 18, 2017, 02:13:00 PM
Wow, That is a great find.

Very nice, thanks for sharing the pix.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Sam McMichael on May 18, 2017, 02:34:00 PM
What a neat trophy!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Gerry on May 18, 2017, 07:23:00 PM
Way cool, really opens up the imagination as to the events leading up to the shot.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: J. Cook on May 19, 2017, 11:27:00 AM
That is awesome!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: johnnyk71 on May 19, 2017, 11:34:00 AM
really amazing find.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: olddogrib on May 19, 2017, 11:40:00 AM
Makes me wonder if there's not more to that story.  Perhaps if you went back and looked in that same area long enough you'd find a Native American hunter's pelvis complete with a momma bison's horn suppository!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Killdeer on May 19, 2017, 05:40:00 PM
I am not educated enough to be able to tell if any healing occurred before the animal's death. If it was successfully harvested, wouldn't you have chopped that head out to use again?

Even though we will never know the whole story, touching the past like that is magic, and humbling.

Killdeer
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Sam McMichael on May 19, 2017, 05:42:00 PM
Does this mean that the ancient ones did not always pick a spot?
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 19, 2017, 08:53:00 PM
The professors, (there were two of them), said that the grey flecking on the bone indicated that it had laid on the surface in an arid or arid like climate. When I acquired the bone I was told it was found in S W Utah, I told them that after their analysis.

I'm speculating that the calf had been wounded and later died unrecovered, otherwise the arrow or at least the arrow point would have been recovered.

I'm also thinking that the shot placement may not have been as far off target as some may think. It stands to reason that the hunter may have been aiming for the paunch or soft area of the animal so as not to have penetration of the arrow stopped by ribs and shoulder bones in a frontal hit. But he missed target slightly hitting the hip bone. A paunch hit would have been lethal and caused the animal to drop out of the herd to die within sight in the open terrain.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 19, 2017, 09:03:00 PM
It pleases me that this has drawn the interest of our old friend Killdeer who never fails to disappoint us with her wise observations.

"Even though we will never know the whole story, touching the past like that is magic, and humbling"
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Gene Wensel on May 20, 2017, 12:32:00 AM
I own a bison vertebra with a flint head in it. I bought it from a guy in Montana who picked it up at a jump. I've had it for over 30 years. I wrote a story about it many years ago for Traditional Bowhunter magazine if I'm not mistaken. I sent mine off to an archeological society in Ohio who studied it. I couldn't believe how much they told me about it. It came from the base of the neck of a young bison. It was buried in gravel, not dirt. The hunter either shot uphill at a very steep angle or the bison was lying on its side when hit, which I believe to be the correct answer since it was found at a jump. It had probably first been driven over the buffalo jump and hurt during the fall. They aged mine at 5,000 to 7,000 years old and suggested it was probably killed with an atlatl rather than a bow. This sort of stuff has always fascinated me, as like arrowheads, each piece has an untold story. At 73 years old, I have recently decided to sell a lot of my collectible artifacts in the very near future. I just sold a petrified shed whitetail antler that was aged at over 11,000 years minimum. Its stone, not bone and much like petrified wood. I actually have a collection of seven or eight more that will probably go on the auction block this fall.
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: olddogrib on May 20, 2017, 07:54:00 AM
Yes, great to hear from her again....I was beginning to worry they might find her under an avalanche of "undeliverable mail" at the back of the FMC's PO.  Now, if someone can just coax Noelle out....
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Ron LaClair on May 20, 2017, 11:28:00 AM
Gene, the rumor that you don't read here anymore must not be true.    :saywhat:

At 73 I think you've got some time left before you start selling off your stuff. I'm 81 and just now thinking about selling some of mine. Is there a market for left hand longbows from 80 to over 100#?    :dunno:
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Gene Wensel on May 20, 2017, 12:33:00 PM
Ron, I don't get on here as much as I used to but still check in fairly regularly if only to read and exercise my eyes! As the median age of us old farts rises, there is going to be a big market for new collectors. Kevin Bishop is your man for those old heavyweight bows...not that he can pull them though!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: Barry Wensel on May 20, 2017, 12:38:00 PM
Hmmm. Gene's 73? And here all along I thought we were twins and I'm only 72. BW
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: The Vanilla Gorilla on May 20, 2017, 03:03:00 PM
QuoteOriginally posted by olddogrib:
Makes me wonder if there's not more to that story.  Perhaps if you went back and looked in that same area long enough you'd find a Native American hunter's pelvis complete with a momma bison's horn suppository!
I always like to imagine that every time i find a broken arrowhead, the other half of it is nearby, lodged in the sternum of a white settler!
Title: Re: I've got this old bone with a flint point in it
Post by: hawkeye n pa on May 20, 2017, 08:41:00 PM
Thanks for sharing Mr. Laclair that's awesome and was also great reading the comments.